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French Tickler buggy

Beerj

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so pardon the ignorance, is that like what TC is doing where he's running a tie rod in addition to the ram? i'm confused how that will help if you hit a tree doing mach jesus
Instead of using the tie-in between the arm and factory location for the steering heim to connect, he would use the red spot I made. Better Ackerman than the stock location. And I might be wrong but I think if you want to run a tie rod with full hydro, they need to mount at the same locations, usually one over the other. If not, then I think they'll fight eachother because they'd be trying to impose different amounts of Ackerman.
 

Bebop

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I like your idea John. Was suggested by a few people. Probably what I'll end up doing.

@jeeptj99 I won't run a tie rod between both knuckles in addition to the ram. I know TC came up with this, but I don't believe it makes any kind of mechanical sense. I think it adds a lot of stress.
 

Bebop

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Plenty of stuff runs a tie rod with a de ram. I think the first time I seen it was on a Kodiak fertilizer spreader truck when I was a kid.

Station (kinda knew what he was talking about) drew it in CAD (and posted on the PBB) and showed the length varies during turning. I don't like the idea.

Double ended ackermann 1


I have seen a full Tie-Rod setup used with 2 SE rams and I've been giving this option some thought.
 

TBItoy

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Dodson Branch, TN
Yeah it would have to have a little slop in the joints and/or it’ll put a little bow in the solid rod when you’re turned.

I agree tho, not necessary for most.
 

Bebop

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Because I hate money and I didn't want to wait forever on a shop that could cut me some arms.

Also, I found 1 stripped hole in the factory knuckle that hit the tree so that helped make the decision easier.

I had to get new ball joint eliminators too, and new heims since the others ones became kinda sloppy. Yeayyy...

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Those are Reid 05+ knuckles that have been machined by BKOR for the RCV Big Bells. They also add a custom keyway and their arms key into the knuckle.

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Bebop

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I ended up spending waaaaaay too long to put this POS back together. Everything that could have made my life harder did.

For some reason, one of the knuckles turned out to be a huge PITA to weld to. Cast is always harder to weld than regular steel, and I've done my fair share of successful welding in it, but this one threw me for a loop.

One of the knuckles welded perfect and after a cool down in a blanket was ready to be installed. The other one had cracks all around the toe of the weld. Took me 4 full re-grind, clean, prep etc to get the weld to fully penetrate and be up to my liking. I ended up using some NI55 rod which made a significant difference in way the puddle behaved and edge control. I even tried to MIG it (which I've done sucessfully in the past) and this was the worst result of all my tries.

I cannot understand the drastic behavior difference between these 2 knuckles. The only 2 reasons I can come up with is that one of the castings wasn't as good as the other, or the welder (not the machine...) really sucks ass at this TIG welding thing. In all honesty, it's probably the later.

But the one that welded fine was looking kinda decent.

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Then, when I thought I was clear to install, the ball joints bit me in the ass. I had a spare set I bought when I installed the knuckles during the original build. Driveworks brand. They worked nice on my OEM 2005-07 knuckles, but for some reason were too big to be pressed on the Reid ones. Because I wanted to move along quickly, I went to the local parts store and got their house brand. They pressed in good but when I went to put the knuckles together, the taper of the stem was wrong and was letting them free-float in the female tapper of the C's. So I had to get a third set and this time I got Moog (like I should have gotten in the first place) and everything went together was supposed to. Of course this was a significant time waster.

When I had it all done good, I fogged the knuckles and arms black in order to hide the bright orange powder coat of the Reid knuckles. I made sure to finish whatever was left in 3 random spray cans of black paint (different shades of course) I had laying around. I'm saving money and making sure the result doesn't look too good. Don't want new shinny parts looking too good on my garbage.

Because I had time between my welding attempts and BJ issues, I ended up spending a few minutes putting lipstick on this pig. Properly shanked all braking hardware, painted the outers, cleaned up and repacked the big bells (they don't have an ounce of play after 3 years of riding) and changed the outer shaft seals.

CD450D87 8CB7 426E A298 3ABE9138F9B0


The new arms have a terrible Ackerman IMO (lines up with the OEM holes) and will need to be redone for optimal performance, but I was trying to put it back together to go ride. I'll spend some time on that later.

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But finally, after much cussing and sweating my ass off in my non-AC shop, she back !

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paradisepwoffrd

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I was just re-reading your last posts. Are you wanting to get reverse or parallel Ackerman with your steering? Having the tierod mounts outboard of the kingpin should create better Ackerman. Since the factory Ackerman is designed around a WB of 142-176", the tierod mount really needs to move farther outboard to give correct Ackerman. Typically the wheel limits that from happening.
 

paradisepwoffrd

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I don't know about better.
But your understanding of Ackerman is correct.

You are correct. It seems that most believe that positive ackerman is ideal, but there are definite arguments for parallel or reverse (negative). Im interested to learn from your experience, on which you feel works the best, as much of the calculations and discussion is around street/race cars.
 

Bebop

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are you worried about welding it 4 times that the heat weakened anything?

Yes. But not much else I could do. Wait and see.

You are correct. It seems that most believe that positive ackerman is ideal, but there are definite arguments for parallel or reverse (negative). Im interested to learn from your experience, on which you feel works the best, as much of the calculations and discussion is around street/race cars.

I am not sure that positive Ackerman is a good thing, even on pavement.

Ackerman F1
 
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Bebop

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Money was the main reason when I built the front axle 3 years ago.
I wasn't about to cut the inner Cs and replace them on this existing axle last month.

One day I'll build another car and it'll have different parts. Not this one.
 

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