letter from David Way DNR asking for volunteers.

[nowires]

Here it is just black and white. No smoke, no mirrors

We have to play by rules that were set forth in the SEPA that it would be gated. That is what certain parties that were involved and wanted for it to go forward. Now that is done. there is no room for discussion, comment of disagreement. That is the way it is going to be. Now we are stuck with this gate that needs to be open and closed for us to have access to the trails and parking
Now if people don't sign up, it will be simple, it will close. Do I think there is a better way yes, I will work on that in the future months

 

[nowires]

I have the gate this weekend.

If you are out there being stupid, I will ruin your life.

Enjoy folks. :awesomework:

Thank Karl

 

[YotaDude1997]

Dear David Way,

At current, how many hiking and horseback riding trails are gated? How many hiking trails require an E & E officer to come out in the morning, open and man a gate all day and close it at the end of the day, every day?

Sincerely, Your Employer (taxpayer).

"At current, how many hiking and horseback riding trails are gated?"

In the Greater Puget Sound area, State Lands (DNR & WSFW) day-use recreation sites are closed from dusk till dawn. All parking areas do indeed have a gate to ensure proper seasonal closure times and dates. The real difference is that the folks using these sites have proven they DO NOT require intensive "baby-sitting".

"How many hiking trails require an E & E officer to come out in the morning, open and man a gate all day and close it at the end of the day, every day?"

How many hiking groups have proven time and time again that there are problem individuals that the larger group cannot control? The motorized community has a REAL problem. Most in the non-motorized community welcome a friendly E&E officers face.


Some folks simply need education to become enlightened. Your problem Mike (and everyone that shares this DB mindset) is your attitude. You have unresolved superstitions, a total lack of empathy and a poor attitude. Resolve these issues and your recreation life will improve.

:beer:

 

[Horus]

The motorized community has a REAL problem. Most in the non-motorized community welcome a friendly E&E officers face.

I didn't know we had a REAL problem. Please define.

In regards to the hikers. I wonder how often a hiker has been stopped by an E&E officer (or a sheriff with an AR-15 like we see regularly at Evans) along the trail and given $1200 with of tickets for everything from "boots cut too low" to "insufficient arm coverage" "jogging on the trail"?

To say motorized users are the problem is to say that garbage dumping and vandalism only occur in ORV areas and nowhere else. Many of my since highschool but not wheelers friends are avid hikers. Hikers are just like us. They carve new trails in their areas or elsewhere and they enjoy hiking at night. They even do it for the same reasons we do. The only difference is nobody says they are a problem. Our government is not spending millions of dollars trying to regulate them.

My "DB" attitude along with everyone else who shares it is forged solely from outside forces. We went from having a ton of world class wheeling terrain open 24/7 365 to sterile thoroughly inorganic trail system on a postage stamp of State Trust land. When you have a significant part of your life taken by someone who couldn't have taken it without your money, especially when we weren't hurting or even bothering anybody it will piss off the average human being. Some people are pushovers and just give in to what others have decided for them, others do not.

To be clear, I am not nor was I ever bashing what has been going on there regarding the new area and/or those involved with it. It is lightyears ahead anything I've seen the DNR or FS do with a trail to date. My post is still as it reads, a critical analysis of the gate and the issues surrounding it.

Neither of my posts called anyone out by name or reverted to name calling. Just sayin'
:awesomework:

 

[YotaDude1997]

I didn't know we had a REAL problem. Please define.

I'd say the ORV communities 1st issue to resolve would be communication. Better communication skills are necessary for your success.

Currently.....the ORV cummunity's ignorance is still rampant.

 

[Horus]

Communication as in responding to a post aimed at entities outside of our community with name calling and attacks against the character of the poster within your own user group? I prefer to challenge ideas I disagree with using valid counterpoints based in logic and whatever hard data is accessable. Strengthening my own stance while tearing down that of my counter. The instant I need to fall to the level of " Oh, you must just hate everything we're trying to do here is all" or "You're just a poopy poopy pants" bullshit I (or anyone else) have lost and forfeit my side of the debate.

That is how I agree with you that communication IS a big problem. Crash got it right with his first post after mine. After that this thread reveled exactly how horrible communication skills can become.

I still don't see how communication is the reason we need to be "intensively babysat" by exponentially increasing amounts of government intrusion and regulation where it is statistically least needed?

 

[crash2]

Call it what you want--I still like the fact its there to protect my play area...

 

[Horus]

Call it what you want--I still like the fact its there to protect my play area...

A point you made perfectly with your first post, and I agree. I can see why you would want to regulate it's use while it is still being built. People get ideas. What becomes of the gate's use after that remains to be seen. For now, I would hate see us lose a chunk of the Reiter budget on another E&E officer. To me they absolutely epitomize wasteful spending. If we can't find enough people to man the gate then I'd vote it just stays shut that weekend. Put the E&E money into a handful of giant Volkswagen sized boulders for the next trail build.

You must understand I have mixed feelings regarding gates. There is one protecting Evans for us right now. Many people I know have mixed feelings regarding gates. Not many positive feelings either.

 

[crash2]

A point you made perfectly with your first post, and I agree. I can see why you would want to regulate it's use while it is still being built. People get ideas. What becomes of the gate's use after that remains to be seen. For now, I would hate see us lose a chunk of the Reiter budget on another E&E officer. To me they absolutely epitomize wasteful spending. If we can't find enough people to man the gate then I'd vote it just stays shut that weekend. Put the E&E money into a handful of giant Volkswagen sized boulders for the next trail build.

You must understand I have mixed feelings regarding gates. There is one protecting Evans for us right now. Many people I know have mixed feelings regarding gates. Not many positive feelings either.

I understand your point--you just gotta trust whats happening and so far the track record on that has been pretty good.


And I too hate gates....

 

[Binder]

Really who gives a **** and why does it matter if the hikers/ carpet munchers/ whoever has a gate around their area? What is this third grade where Jimmy has a ball at recess and we don't? The fact is our areas currently need a gate to help protect what we have. Until the "big" problem is fixed we need to deal with the gate situation best we can.
And for the record, I don't think communication is the root of our problems. The bigger problem is that most of the people who are communicating are ****ing stupid! :cheer:

Have a great day!:awesomework:

 

[YotaDude1997]

And for the record, I don't think communication is the root of our problems. The bigger problem is that most of the people who are communicating are ****ing stupid! :cheer:

This is a fact we're not ready to deal with....yet.:corn:

 

[YotaDude1997]

I still don't see how communication is the reason we need to be "intensively babysat" by exponentially increasing amounts of government intrusion and regulation where it is statistically least needed?

You own perspective is where this journey will start. First your eyes open up, then your ears clear out and then.....then, your mind will join in. And only after these things happen will the words that come out of your mouth be educated and enlightened.

 

[boxboy]

boy did i start a **** storm... :awesomework::cheer:

i think I will go for a walk about at Reiter today to see how much snow is out there :hi: :squirrel::beatdeadhorse::sommer::redneck:

 

[Maverick26]

Epic

please someone buy my buggy so I can buy some hiking boots.

 

[crash2]

So how much was up there Scott?

 

[boxboy]

2" to 4" inches on the trails

4" in the parking lot

 

[crash2]

Cool beans. Might head up there tommorow for a few hours of play time...

 

[KarlVP]

2" to 4" inches on the trails

4" in the parking lot

I almost killed your snowman today.

Cool beans. Might head up there tommorow for a few hours of play time...

Missed you today loverboy.

 

[Jacob]

This is a fact we're not ready to deal with....yet.:corn:

It HAS to be dealt with. Or everything could be gone. The problem is....you guessed it.... The problem is we are not even COMMUNICATING with those that cause most of our problems. They think these trails are an open free for all for everyone. They are a private place for teenager to have relations, a place where idiots think it's ok to drink and drive and not get caught, a cool place to go dump garbage. I've been around this long enough to know along with the rest of you where the problems come from. SPOILER ALERT- it isn't anyone from here or any other board you are on. It's the people using these areas that are completely uneducated. It's up to US to police them. Open and close gates, call them out when we see it, pick the **** up that they leave. I HATE government. But at this point, it's all we have. We pay them, let's let them work for us so we can start getting areas back for educated use. I love to go up in the hills and have fun. That's what got me there in the first place. But at this point we HAVE to keep it between the ditches or it's all going to be gone.

 

[NOISYBOY]

Epic

please someone buy my buggy so I can buy some hiking boots.

what size boots you wear? ill trade you if they fit :haha::haha: