Menu
Forums
New posts
Search forums
Calendar
Monthly
Weekly
Agenda
Archive
What's new
New posts
New media
New media comments
New profile posts
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Members
Current visitors
New profile posts
Search profile posts
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles and first posts only
Search titles only
By:
New posts
Search forums
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Help Support Hardline Crawlers :
Forums
Rock Crawling Forums
Trail Rides & Competitions
Elbe question
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Gibby1" data-source="post: 988640" data-attributes="member: 15983"><p>Yes and no. The ATVs have their own trail system up there separate to the 4x4 system. We're not allowed to use their trails. ATVs are allowed to use our trails but they must follow the same rules as we do which is to stay on the trails. The ATVs have to use the same common sense that the 4x4s do. If the trail's too tough for me or my ATV, then turn around and go back or don't go on that trail.</p><p></p><p>On the flip side to that we are working with the DNR to allow the development of legal bypasses where available, particularly if a specific section of trail or a specific obstacle is significantly more difficult than the rest of the trail. For example, if a trail is generally doable by a LWB vehicle except for one spot where the trees are simply too close together causing undue damage or making physically impossible for the LWB vehicle to fit, then making a bypass so that the LWB vehicle can navigate that section and use the entire trial is sensible. However, if the majority of the trail is not suitable for LWB vehicles we're not going to consider bypasses around everything just so that a LWB doesn't get discriminated against. Same story with ATVs. If they can navigate the trail do so, if not, stay off - they already have a separate trail system built and maintained just for them. I personally put the ATV in the same class here as say, a Sami (no offense Sami owners). The smaller tired Sami's can often negotiate obstacles that they aren't big enough to handle, simple because they have so many line choices. A Sami on 33s can go places a 4runner on 33s wouldn't dream about. If there is a section of a trail not suitable for a Sami, but the rest of the trail is, and if a suitable bypass can be made (most likely someone already did) we'll do so for the Sami, but not with the specific intent of accomodating the ATVs.</p><p></p><p>I'm not anti-ATV by any means. My kids all ride ATVs. They're all ORV tagged and we built our own track.</p><p></p><p>I don't see us specifically considering making the 4x4 trails suitable for the ATVs however, if the ATV volunteer groups want to work with the DNR and make bypasses on the 4x4 trails, we can't stop them. The 4x4 trails are then only ones designated as multi-use and those who work on them are those who get to use them. Technically these trails can be used by hikers, horses, motorcycles, ATVs, snowmobiles and 4x4s, but the 4x4 can ONLY use the 4x4 trails. Since the other user groups have their own trails at Elbe, we don't have to make our trails SUITable for the other user groups.</p><p></p><p>On Rainier Vista, we hope to designate this as a 5/5 rated trail with 35" and larger tires, dual lockers and winch recommended. All ATVs should be able to read the signs and make a decision to try another trail. I am working on makeing this trail and the Busywild a NON-ATV trail. I don't know if this will fly but 90% of the user built bypasses and related damage are started by ATVs that don't belong on the trail. The rest of the 4x4 trails are passable by ATVs.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Gibby1, post: 988640, member: 15983"] Yes and no. The ATVs have their own trail system up there separate to the 4x4 system. We're not allowed to use their trails. ATVs are allowed to use our trails but they must follow the same rules as we do which is to stay on the trails. The ATVs have to use the same common sense that the 4x4s do. If the trail's too tough for me or my ATV, then turn around and go back or don't go on that trail. On the flip side to that we are working with the DNR to allow the development of legal bypasses where available, particularly if a specific section of trail or a specific obstacle is significantly more difficult than the rest of the trail. For example, if a trail is generally doable by a LWB vehicle except for one spot where the trees are simply too close together causing undue damage or making physically impossible for the LWB vehicle to fit, then making a bypass so that the LWB vehicle can navigate that section and use the entire trial is sensible. However, if the majority of the trail is not suitable for LWB vehicles we're not going to consider bypasses around everything just so that a LWB doesn't get discriminated against. Same story with ATVs. If they can navigate the trail do so, if not, stay off - they already have a separate trail system built and maintained just for them. I personally put the ATV in the same class here as say, a Sami (no offense Sami owners). The smaller tired Sami's can often negotiate obstacles that they aren't big enough to handle, simple because they have so many line choices. A Sami on 33s can go places a 4runner on 33s wouldn't dream about. If there is a section of a trail not suitable for a Sami, but the rest of the trail is, and if a suitable bypass can be made (most likely someone already did) we'll do so for the Sami, but not with the specific intent of accomodating the ATVs. I'm not anti-ATV by any means. My kids all ride ATVs. They're all ORV tagged and we built our own track. I don't see us specifically considering making the 4x4 trails suitable for the ATVs however, if the ATV volunteer groups want to work with the DNR and make bypasses on the 4x4 trails, we can't stop them. The 4x4 trails are then only ones designated as multi-use and those who work on them are those who get to use them. Technically these trails can be used by hikers, horses, motorcycles, ATVs, snowmobiles and 4x4s, but the 4x4 can ONLY use the 4x4 trails. Since the other user groups have their own trails at Elbe, we don't have to make our trails SUITable for the other user groups. On Rainier Vista, we hope to designate this as a 5/5 rated trail with 35" and larger tires, dual lockers and winch recommended. All ATVs should be able to read the signs and make a decision to try another trail. I am working on makeing this trail and the Busywild a NON-ATV trail. I don't know if this will fly but 90% of the user built bypasses and related damage are started by ATVs that don't belong on the trail. The rest of the 4x4 trails are passable by ATVs. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Latest posts
Pickett State Park/Blackhouse Mountian 1-23-2016
Latest: ridered3
Yesterday at 3:12 PM
Trail Rides & Competitions
Daves Offroad Supply
Latest: Daves Offroad Supply
Wednesday at 10:52 AM
Vendors
B
For Sale
Artec Back-bone truss for 14 bolt
Latest: Bebop
Tuesday at 7:19 PM
Off Road 4x4 Parts For Sale
P
YouTube of the day
Latest: paradisepwoffrd
Monday at 8:21 AM
General Discussion
Cash LeCroy Illness
Latest: ridered3
Sunday at 2:58 PM
General Discussion
Forums
Rock Crawling Forums
Trail Rides & Competitions
Elbe question
Top