Reiter Updates: Summer/Fall 2010

Binder said:

I think you got jipped Neil because the rest of us got the 2007 edition which covers "the half rule" which is "The trail grade should be no more than half the sideslope grade.". I have a few copies of this for anyone who wants one. Show up for the Walker work party on the weekend of the 21st and I'll give out what I have....4 or 5 copies.:awesomework:

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Yeah I got the newer ones too. This link was the one I got when I Googled it. :; That book just seems more like it was written for hiking trails.

Most recent map of the non-motorized area and conceptual trails: http://www.dnr.wa.gov/Publications/amp_rec_reiter_non-moto_trail_concept_map.pdf

More non-motorized junk

Went and helped at my first non-motorized work party. "Work" is a misnomer, as there was no "work" done.......but trail mapping and trail flagging was completed, and was the focus of the workparty. Mission accomplished.:awesomework:

Since the focus was mapping and flagging the mountain bike area, I was really of no use. So Scott (boxboy) and I headed towards the possible rock climbing/bouldering walls that Charlie (nowires) found on his adventures, months earlier.


Bouldering. There are more than few perfect bouldering rocks.




I'm not real familiar with judging the rating of bouldering, but easy to hard route are available. Maybe not as numerous and the Outlet Mall area, but still worthy.




The climbing wall opportunities are numerous.





Some could be multi-pitch routes.





I'd say there are ratings between 5.7 to 5.12 routes......something for everyone.





Some belay stations could be sketchy.....perfect.:redneck:





As with all top climbs, the views are great.




And this is only one section of 2.......:clappy: I have some more exploring to do.

Couple notes: There is no rock climbing in the Reiter Trails master plan and the DNR has promised climbers nothing; and there could be an accessibility and access issue to the location of where these walls are.

If these walls peak the interest of other climbers, we'll go from there.

Here's where they are.

Here is the trail

View attachment 46395

Money Mark said:

Couple notes: There is no rock climbing in the Reiter Trails master plan and the DNR has promised climbers nothing; and there could be an accessibility and access issue to the location of where these walls are.

If these walls peak the interest of other climbers, we'll go from there.

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Being that everything at Reiter is open on foot the climbers can have it all now. More power to them.:awesomework:

Binder said:

Being that everything at Reiter is open on foot the climbers can have it all now. More power to them.:awesomework:

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I apologize, I should have been more clear and detailed. Ease of accessibility is the issue. The access I am referring to is the problematic May Creek crossing and the fact that these rock walls will be better accessed from the West; the non-motorized (future) parking area or even the Wallace Falls area.

Nothing new to report for the motorized area. The non-motorized area is currently getting all the attention. Mapping and flagging non-motorized trails is the task to complete, for the DNR and volunteers.

The SEPA for the motorized area should be released soon (30-60 days); a SEPA is a pass or fail type situation. If/when it passes, it will be a milestone to the process of re-opening New Reiter.

Exert taken from the Sept 23rd Reiter Foothills, DNR news letter:

We are continuing to work on the motorized trail plan and associated documents to prepare for the State Environmental Policy Act (SEPA) review process and applying for permits from Snohomish County. We are working on more detailed trail design for those motorized trails that are not located in critical areas and we are considering for the first phase of construction. Work includes field verification of data collected; trail design and construction detailing, drainage and grading; technical reports; cost estimates; and trail construction specifications.

At this stage, we are translating field notes into the GIS system, giving us information on slope and drainage patterns, and calculations for the amount of cut and fill slopes for different types of trails. All this information is required for getting a grading permit.

We are coordinating with Snohomish County to identify permit and report requirements. We know the county will require a Land Disturbance Activity Permit, and there may be others.

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Just got home from a VERY informative Reiter Focus Group meeting with the DNR and select few ORV users, among others.

Discussion points of interest:

1. The SEPA will be released at the end of November. From there, there will be a 30 day public comment period. If all goes well and there are no real issues brought up or lawsuits filed, we can consider that hurdle jumped. This is a VERY good thing!:cheer:

2. In order to maximize grant/funding opportunities, the DNR has decided to team up with the Fish & Wildlife. More on this at a later date; after/if the bill has been passed through legislation. VERY political and VERY boring stuff. But the ramifications to Reiter could be.......complicated.

3. The DNR and the F&W will be proposing a bill to start a fee based recreation pass. Like the Forest service has. $40 per person was to number we were told. This would be gathered into a general fund to distribute between the DNR and F&W for operational activities........also to help fund Reiter.

4. Permits (for the trail building) through the County can take anywhere from 4-9 months. The filing for these permits will be done shortly after the SEPA 30 day public comment period is over.

5. Kim might be hired back to educate and enforce at Walker and Reiter. I always liked Kim.:awesomework:

I wish I would have taken notes, as some of the other pertinent info escapes me right now. I'll post up when my mind decides to remind me.

Binder was there......maybe he can fill in some of the blanks.:corn:





Bottom line: We are at a stand-still until funding/grants become available. We have a LONG ways to go folks. Just being honest.

:squirrel:

More questions!

Money Mark said:

2. In order to maximize grant/funding opportunities, the DNR has decided to team up with the Fish & Wildlife. More on this at a later date; after/if the bill has been passed through legislation. VERY political and VERY boring stuff. But the ramifications to Reiter could be.......complicated.

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So, both WDFW and DNR will be managing Reiter?

Money Mark said:

3. The DNR and the F&W will be proposing a bill to start a fee based recreation pass. Like the Forest service has. $40 per person was to number we were told. This would be gathered into a general fund to distribute between the DNR and F&W for operational activities........also to help fund Reiter.

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Is this going to be for ALL DNR and WDFW lands? Like, say you use a WDFW boat launch, right now you need a free parking pass, will this now change? How will these funds be divided? Is there an "official" proposal online that we could read through?

By "per person" do you mean, per vehicle, or per ORV and tow rig, or???

Money Mark said:

5. Kim might be hired back to educate and enforce at Walker and Reiter. I always liked Kim.:awesomework:
:

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Kim kicks ass

Will she be hired for the position that they have the funding for at Walker? I know there is a hiring freeze right now, so are they going to have to wait till thats over? Is she going to be an "armed" LEO?

boardbysled said:

More questions! I love questions.......when I can answer 'em.



So, both WDFW and DNR will be managing Reiter? No. They will still manage their own respective lands. By "teaming up" they will "get more money"........that's the theory atleast.


Is this going to be for ALL DNR and WDFW lands? Like, say you use a WDFW boat launch, right now you need a free parking pass, will this now change? How will these funds be divided? Is there an "official" proposal online that we could read through? Yes, all recreation lands. Funds should be divided 50/50.......but this where the "complicated" aspect comes into play. No official proposal that I know of.

By "per person" do you mean, per vehicle, or per ORV and tow rig, or??? Per person. So if you have 2 people in you car, each person should have a recreation pass.


Kim kicks ass

Will she be hired for the position that they have the funding for at Walker? I know there is a hiring freeze right now, so are they going to have to wait till thats over? Is she going to be an "armed" LEO? I don't know about Walker, it was only briefly discussed. And I don't know how the hire freeze will play out with Kim and her (possible) job. As with her previous duties, her job would be to educate and enforce only........heavier on the educate part.

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Red-Rum......!!!

Money Mark said:

Per person. So if you have 2 people in you car, each person should have a recreation pass.

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Ouch, this one sucks IMO.

Doing a rough estimate though, at that price/cost, we are going to see a HUGE funding increase for DNR recreation. This could be a very good thing. But, it could also mean that it turns out like FS and they "pave" all the trails because they have the funding now.uke:

Guess the one seater rig guys are going to have a real good deal if they do it this way.:fawkdancesmiley:

Hopefully they decide to do it more like the FS, that would be better IMO.

Money Mark said:

Hope for the best, expect the worse.

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So, we are still on schedule at this current time. By schedule, I mean that work may be started next summer?

boardbysled said:

So, we are still on schedule at this current time. By schedule, I mean that work may be started next summer?

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Yes. Pending funding.

And it should be noted that without all the hard work behind the scenes (that most ORV users will never know or truly appreciate) the "schedule" would be MUCH further behind than where we currently are.

The DNR (and a few key volunteers) is working harder on this than most folks will ever give them credit for.

Money prety much said it, couple things to add though......The way I understood it Kims (or a person such as Kim) position is dependant on grant money comming in. DNR is in the process of applying for those grants now.....The $40 pass would be just like a hunting or fishing license. Each person who uses the woods including hikers, IIRC kids were free or cheaper. There needs to be legistative changes in order to make this one come true so it won't happen tomorrow and it would apply to all of DNR land the way I understand it.........The DNR wants to do construction in phases which is understood. The phases are based on work which could be done with basic- easier to get permit work going in the first phase and more sensitive work starting in phase two. This would let us get started sooner than later.......The DNR has asked us to help stop the rumors that they are dragging their feet and don't want Reiter open. This isn't true and it looks to me like they're putting a lot of work and effort into these things.......Reiter open house Nov 14th. Come and walk it and ask questions/ see it for yourself............
Long ways to go folks and anything could happen but even though it looks slow right now things are moving behind the scenes.:awesomework:

the easy way to put it is
every hiker, mountian biker, climber, motor biker, and wheeler WILL have to have a pass unless you are 18 and under

this would generate over 4 mil a year for DNR rec to opperate on. THey are proposing a 1,5 mil budget to opperate. THis gives them a 2.5 mil built in improvments budget

This is one of the complaints that the last sepa had is that DNR had to come up with a way to finance day to day opperations of the trust lands. What this does is open up the NOVA fund for capital projects with out having to depend on the NOVA fund for opperations

pokey said:

The idea of a pass is great but on a per person basis brings on the suck. If you bring a friend or coworker type thing it will cost $40 for a day in the woods :eeek::booo: Hopefully they see the idea sticks and come up with a more usable soulution such as a seasonal pass and a daily pass.

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Good point Jim and as I recall there would be a comment period before any of this goes into effect. I know part of the reason for doing it this way is they don't want to collect fees at the user sites so a yearly pass helps out that way. They eventually want to combine this program with the FS pass program so everyone could have one pass. The FS has daily passes so........

I heard there will be a day pass avalible, just like the trail passes for a day pass rate. What the rate is, I don't know

I think it evens the playing field. You don't get the 12 passenger van hiking for 50 bucks a year

I also think that the free childs pass should stop at 15yr old

So is this new public lands lic. Gonna work for all dnr property or do you need to buy one for rieter one for walker and on and on. Because if it's like a fishing lic you need one for fresh one for salt an endorsment to crab, shrimp, shellfish, blah blah blah blah blah.