Four Cylinders

[TacomaJD]

Re:

Anybody can drive over a rock crawl course fast, it's whether or not your rig will hold up by the time you get to the end. You can drive fast enough over a rock crawl course in a 4 banger to bust your drivetrain all to **** if it ain't built right..... so you have to have axles, t case, driveshafts, etc that will keep up with your driving style, not so much motor.

Thus meaning if you are already running bigger tires, your junk is probably built for them and take more of a beating, being faster than those with smaller, weaker drivetrains and smaller tires.

Example, my Toy buggy 22r on pane with IFS Toy rearend/FJ80 front goes head to head with BJ's (bamatoy) rig Toyota buggy with 22r on pane but has tons under it, on a rock crawl course. Basically same engines and dual t case set up, but he will be able to beat his rig way harder and bounce over rocks that I would have to drive a bit slower across, so not to break my birfs, rear axles, or gears. So he would be faster.

Same scenario with my rig against a cherokee on D44's and 35's, I think my junk would hold up a bit better, likely to have better suspension with more travel, and beat his time.

 

[CASHED]

Re:

Why is motor even that big of an issue with a ROCK CRAWL course? To me it should be limited by tire size if anything. On a ROCK CRAWL course, I wouldn't be afraid to run my junk against just about anything. Now hill shooting, bounty hill, all that is different. That's where motor comes in.

I totally agree. I 've been to some stock class rock racing in Northern California, and they have no motor rules, and its an absolute blast to watch the cherokees and toyotas battle it out. Here is a copy of their rules;
STOCK CLASS 35 and UNDER
-Full frame/ full door or door bar
-stock suspension lift ok
-IFS swap to straight axle with leaf spring ok
-1 shock per corner, window nets, arm restraint, factory seat belts ok

As long as somebody goes all Duke Boys and the crowd goes wild is all that matters!

 

[Pumpkin]

Re: Re: Four Cylinders

I like the 4 banger rule. But yes no buggies. It would have to have some of the factory frame. But I would not say a factory motor. To many have put 1.6 in their Sammi. But some have truggy's also with coil overs or airshocks.

 

[Pumpkin]

Re: Re: Four Cylinders

So I would not limit it to leaf Springs or factory suspension.

 

[Rokcrler]

Re:

This is getting complicated...

 

[bamatoy]

Re:

Anybody can drive over a rock crawl course fast, it's whether or not your rig will hold up by the time you get to the end. You can drive fast enough over a rock crawl course in a 4 banger to bust your drivetrain all to **** if it ain't built right..... so you have to have axles, t case, driveshafts, etc that will keep up with your driving style, not so much motor.

Thus meaning if you are already running bigger tires, your junk is probably built for them and take more of a beating, being faster than those with smaller, weaker drivetrains and smaller tires.

Example, my Toy buggy 22r on pane with IFS Toy rearend/FJ80 front goes head to head with BJ's (bamatoy) rig Toyota buggy with 22r on pane but has tons under it, on a rock crawl course. Basically same engines and dual t case set up, but he will be able to beat his rig way harder and bounce over rocks that I would have to drive a bit slower across, so not to break my birfs, rear axles, or gears. So he would be faster.

Same scenario with my rig against a cherokee on D44's and 35's, I think my junk would hold up a bit better, likely to have better suspension with more travel, and beat his time.

Josh I wouldn't beat you cause I have tons and can hit stuff faster. I would beat you cause I am skilled beyond my years . Know dat

Edit: besides you won't have a free hand to shift gears with that can always in you hand

 

[billstoy]

I love It! I want a class 4 cyl toyota "only" dual cases only ! no turbo, or NO2, buggies only, no stock rails, 16" coilovers only ! 42 TSL tires only! All buggies must be yellow and blue! DNF's still win !! It's all about me the "Bill's Class"!!!! I WIN !!! Think I'm just gona ride , No politics !! everyone should have their own class !!! most of you don't believe in PC everyone gets a throphy "But that is what you are all posting !! I need my own class! Sorry Tom !you could be waisting your time !! It was a good idea!

 

[TacomaJD]

Re: Re: Re:

Josh I wouldn't beat you cause I have tons and can hit stuff faster. I would beat you cause I am skilled beyond my years . Know dat

Edit: besides you won't have a free hand to shift gears with that can always in you hand

Beyond your years? Maybe FOR your years, you are kinda old

And the can that's always in my hand will likely be prohibited during competition. It would be unfair to the competition if I was allowed to consume adult bevs while racing.

 

[billstoy]

I hope TC does not build a 500hp 4cyl. hill killer !!!

 

[hjpcummins]

I would be game!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[CASHED]

I hope TC does not build a 500hp 4cyl. hill killer !!!

I'd say if he did he would be racing against the 300 hp buggies in the the big class.

 

[The Luke]

Re: Re: Four Cylinders

I'd like to see some of the kids with trans axle setups compete in this. Either way, should be a good show.

 

[zayne2427]

Re:

This is getting complicated...

Got complicated quick. How about start with a good 4cyl trail ride for all of us low budget wheelers and go from there. I'd rather ride and fellowship than race anyways. And been wanting to come to AOP for a while

 

[smbroady82]

Re:

Got complicated quick. How about start with a good 4cyl trail ride for all of us low budget wheelers and go from there. I'd rather ride and fellowship than race anyways. And been wanting to come to AOP for a while

x2
id be down for a 4cyl ride. . need to come check AOP out anyways

 

[Rusty Nuts]

Why not just run what you brung the only restriction should be it has to be a 4 cylinder engine. I'm sure the course will have strengths and weaknesses for small or big tire rig. I mean I run 40s with a stock 22re in my beater and it's slow as **** :****: I just hope everyone stops making it so complicated with restrictions. It will take all the fun of the whole idea away. I think it's awesome that Tom is thinking of all the guys that don't have deep pockets

And for everyone that hasn't been to AOP yet your missing out!! The park is awesome he has put a ton of work into it in the past year!

 

[FullThrottle89]

I have no dog in this race but I have to race against people like the tanners and Lc and hitman who have 3x more power than me and bling parts. so I say run what you brung and stop crying about HP numbers or tire size. nut up or shut up. just my opinion.....my buddy in his sammy has no problem if you have a turbo. its all fun and games at the end of the day.

 

[patooyee]

hmmm...

I looked up some specs on factory turbo EcoTecs, the first gen turbo eco tecs make 260 lb-ft and the new ones are up to 295 lb-ft.

Pretty impressive, especially for OEM spec/tune with all emissions junk in place!

Oh if I could only find a wrecked Saturn Sky Redline or Pontiac Solstice GXP :****:

I think this is the one I would want due to power, torque curve, availability and price.

LNF[edit]


Ecotec LNF in a Pontiac Solstice
A turbocharged direct injected (redubbed Spark Ignition Direct Injection) Ecotec was introduced in the 2007 Pontiac Solstice GXP and Saturn Sky Red Line. In these applications, the engine is mounted longitudinally. Displacement is 2.0 L—1,998 cc (121.9 cu in)—with a square 86 millimetres (3.4 in) bore and stroke. Compression is 9.2:1 and maximum boost is 1.4 bar (20.0 psi), delivering 260 hp (190 kW) at 5300 rpm and 260 lb·ft (350 N·m) of torque from 2500 to 5250 rpm. Engine redline is at 6300 rpm and premium fuel is recommended. The sodium filled exhaust valves were based on technology developed for the Corvette V8 powertrains. The sodium fuses and becomes a liquid at idle, which improves conductivity and draws heat away from the valve face and valve guide towards the stem to be cooled by the engine oil circulating in this area. The camshaft-driven direct injection systems pressurizes the fuel to 31 bar (450 psi) at idle, and up to 155 bar (2,250 psi) at wide-open throttle. The "Gen II" block is similar to the 2.4 L and also features VVT technology. The Gen II block was developed using data from racing programs and computer simulations. The bore walls and bulkheads were strengthened with a weight increase of 1 kg (2.5 pounds). The coolant jackets were expanded to improve heat transfer, resulting in a coolant capacity increase of 0.5 liters.
In December 2008, GM released a Turbo Upgrade Kit for the LNF engine which increases horsepower to 290 hp (220 kW) and torque to up to 340 lb·ft (460 N·m), depending on the model. The kit retails for $650 and includes remapped engine calibration and upgraded MAP sensors. The kit is covered by the cars' existing GM warranties.[5]
Unique LNF features[6] include:
a twin-scroll turbocharger
cam-driven high-pressure gasoline direct injection fuel system
dual camshaft continuously variable valve timing
sodium-filled stainless steel Inconel exhaust valves
low-friction cast aluminum pistons with oil squirters
forged steel crankshaft
forged steel connecting rods
cast stainless steel exhaust manifold
This engine is used in:
Year(s) Model Power Torque
2007–2009 Opel GT 260 hp (190 kW) @ 5300 rpm 260 lb·ft (353 N·m) @ 2000 rpm
2007–2009 Pontiac Solstice GXP 260 hp (190 kW) @ 5300 rpm 260 lb·ft (353 N·m) @ 2000 rpm
2007–2009 Saturn Sky Red Line 260 hp (190 kW) @ 5300 rpm 260 lb·ft (353 N·m) @ 2000 rpm
2008–2010 Chevrolet HHR SS 260 hp (190 kW) @ 5300 rpm 260 lb·ft (353 N·m) @ 2000 rpm
2008–2010 Chevrolet Cobalt SS 260 hp (190 kW) @ 5300 rpm 260 lb·ft (353 N·m) @ 2000 rpm
2009 Elfin T5 264 hp (197 kW) @ 5300 rpm 259 lb·ft (351 N·m) @ 2000 rpm
2012 Fisker Karma 260 hp (190 kW) @ 5300 rpm 260 lb·ft (353 N·m) @ 2000 rpm

 

[TBItoy]

I think this is the one I would want due to power, torque curve, availability and price.

LNF[edit]


Ecotec LNF in a Pontiac Solstice
A turbocharged direct injected (redubbed Spark Ignition Direct Injection) Ecotec was introduced in the 2007 Pontiac Solstice GXP and Saturn Sky Red Line. In these applications, the engine is mounted longitudinally. Displacement is 2.0 L—1,998 cc (121.9 cu in)—with a square 86 millimetres (3.4 in) bore and stroke. Compression is 9.2:1 and maximum boost is 1.4 bar (20.0 psi), delivering 260 hp (190 kW) at 5300 rpm and 260 lb·ft (350 N·m) of torque from 2500 to 5250 rpm. Engine redline is at 6300 rpm and premium fuel is recommended. The sodium filled exhaust valves were based on technology developed for the Corvette V8 powertrains. The sodium fuses and becomes a liquid at idle, which improves conductivity and draws heat away from the valve face and valve guide towards the stem to be cooled by the engine oil circulating in this area. The camshaft-driven direct injection systems pressurizes the fuel to 31 bar (450 psi) at idle, and up to 155 bar (2,250 psi) at wide-open throttle. The "Gen II" block is similar to the 2.4 L and also features VVT technology. The Gen II block was developed using data from racing programs and computer simulations. The bore walls and bulkheads were strengthened with a weight increase of 1 kg (2.5 pounds). The coolant jackets were expanded to improve heat transfer, resulting in a coolant capacity increase of 0.5 liters.
In December 2008, GM released a Turbo Upgrade Kit for the LNF engine which increases horsepower to 290 hp (220 kW) and torque to up to 340 lb·ft (460 N·m), depending on the model. The kit retails for $650 and includes remapped engine calibration and upgraded MAP sensors. The kit is covered by the cars' existing GM warranties.[5]
Unique LNF features[6] include:
a twin-scroll turbocharger
cam-driven high-pressure gasoline direct injection fuel system
dual camshaft continuously variable valve timing
sodium-filled stainless steel Inconel exhaust valves
low-friction cast aluminum pistons with oil squirters
forged steel crankshaft
forged steel connecting rods
cast stainless steel exhaust manifold
This engine is used in:
Year(s) Model Power Torque
2007–2009 Opel GT 260 hp (190 kW) @ 5300 rpm 260 lb·ft (353 N·m) @ 2000 rpm
2007–2009 Pontiac Solstice GXP 260 hp (190 kW) @ 5300 rpm 260 lb·ft (353 N·m) @ 2000 rpm
2007–2009 Saturn Sky Red Line 260 hp (190 kW) @ 5300 rpm 260 lb·ft (353 N·m) @ 2000 rpm
2008–2010 Chevrolet HHR SS 260 hp (190 kW) @ 5300 rpm 260 lb·ft (353 N·m) @ 2000 rpm
2008–2010 Chevrolet Cobalt SS 260 hp (190 kW) @ 5300 rpm 260 lb·ft (353 N·m) @ 2000 rpm
2009 Elfin T5 264 hp (197 kW) @ 5300 rpm 259 lb·ft (351 N·m) @ 2000 rpm
2012 Fisker Karma 260 hp (190 kW) @ 5300 rpm 260 lb·ft (353 N·m) @ 2000 rpm

260 lb ft at 2000 rpm is damn impressive.

I bet most of the v8s in trail rigs 10 years ago didn't have that.

 

[5onrocks]

Keep it simple and I'm in... I have a clapped out 1.3, 6' of factory frame rail in a linked, air shock and Coilover buggy on 39" reds. I'm not going to win any point and shoot hill killer comps but I will hold my own on a rock "crawling" course. 4 cylinder, cage, 4 point harness and a helmet sounds good on rules. Just keep everyone safe and let it pan out. A ride/ comp like this may not bring as many spectators but I bet it would bring just as many riders and competitors.

 

[TBItoy]

If it's a crawling/actual rock trail.completion, then HP doesn't necessarily make a damn.

A few years ago I got 3rd of 20+ rigs at the Dixie run comp in the "big class" in my beater Toyota buggy.
It was a race up and back down honey bee, which is all nasty big rocks