Elbe Rock crawl and Rainier Vista

[Gibby1]

And there we are were argueing over agreeing again. I am not saying that the trail should be built for everyone just that turning it into a hardcore buggy type rig only trail is not in the best interest either.

We all just like to argue with you Pokey!

I agree in principal that if we were given the opportunity to build an ORV park from scratch, we'd set it up so that all trails could be shared with multple lines for various vehicles, likes and dislikes, etc.

Reality is that we don't have that option.

The Rainier Vista will be a hardcore trail and vehicles not meeting the recommendations, should not attempt it. It's clearly marked as such and an appropriate gate keeper will ensure that it works that way (in an ideal world). There will likely be some areas or lines that are harder than others but only the elite will navigate this trail without pulling cable somewhere.

 

[Money Mark]

.....but only the elite will navigate this trail without pulling cable somewhere.

Very good.:awesomework:

 

[JAWS]

Im glad to see us closer to a rock crawl at Elbe. the first thread started 11-30-07 Its nice to finally get some thing done..... Thank you Gibby and your club.

 

[jeepmauler]

The Rainier Vista will be a hardcore trail and vehicles not meeting the recommendations, should not attempt it. It's clearly marked as such and an appropriate gate keeper will ensure that it works that way (in an ideal world). There will likely be some areas or lines that are harder than others but only the elite will navigate this trail without pulling cable somewhere.

Good luck with that:awesomework: The "Need to be included" crowd will RUIN ANY "hardcore" trail with stacking/bypasses Unless a LEO is posted at the entrance to police....the bolt-on crowd will push/elbow/stack/bypass their way in so they can be "hardcore" too. I've watched ten years worth of "hardcore" trails be ruined by peoples "RIGHT" to wheel the same trails I do....Unless you build something like the OM that has DIRE consequences for failure.....you will be unable to keep the trail pavers out....I hope it works out for ya because I'd love to come over and run something gnarly....but I just don't see it happening in the obama/everyones included world we live inissed:

 

[Fullywrecked]

Good luck with that:awesomework: The "Need to be included" crowd will RUIN ANY "hardcore" trail with stacking/bypasses Unless a LEO is posted at the entrance to police....the bolt-on crowd will push/elbow/stack/bypass their way in so they can be "hardcore" too. I've watched ten years worth of "hardcore" trails be ruined by peoples "RIGHT" to wheel the same trails I do....Unless you build something like the OM that has DIRE consequences for failure.....you will be unable to keep the trail pavers out....I hope it works out for ya because I'd love to come over and run something gnarly....but I just don't see it happening in the obama/everyones included world we live inissed:

Well put!:beer::redneck:

 

[grant1]

Good luck with that:awesomework: The "Need to be included" crowd will RUIN ANY "hardcore" trail with stacking/bypasses Unless a LEO is posted at the entrance to police....the bolt-on crowd will push/elbow/stack/bypass their way in so they can be "hardcore" too. I've watched ten years worth of "hardcore" trails be ruined by peoples "RIGHT" to wheel the same trails I do....Unless you build something like the OM that has DIRE consequences for failure.....you will be unable to keep the trail pavers out....I hope it works out for ya because I'd love to come over and run something gnarly....but I just don't see it happening in the obama/everyones included world we live inissed:

WOW, what a way too look at things. I'm not a master fabricator and buy alot of my parts. I might not be super buggy, but I can go where I want. The less qualified rigs will learn not to go on the trail, just like they have on the Busy Wild and other hard core trails..

 

[Gibby1]

A trail will naturally evolve. Some places will get paved, others will get harder. Hopefully with good signage, a good gatekeeper and responsible usage, it won't be too bad.

 

[pokey]

Good luck with that:awesomework: The "Need to be included" crowd will RUIN ANY "hardcore" trail with stacking/bypasses Unless a LEO is posted at the entrance to police....the bolt-on crowd will push/elbow/stack/bypass their way in so they can be "hardcore" too. I've watched ten years worth of "hardcore" trails be ruined by peoples "RIGHT" to wheel the same trails I do....Unless you build something like the OM that has DIRE consequences for failure.....you will be unable to keep the trail pavers out....I hope it works out for ya because I'd love to come over and run something gnarly....but I just don't see it happening in the obama/everyones included world we live inissed:

If your trying to make a point about my posts then your missing my point. When you built the outlet mall you went out and built a entirely new trail to suit your needs. What were talking about at Elbe is taking a allready built trail that despite Gibbys claims does see a lot of use and turning it into something only a few can use. I have no issues with building a new trail of this sort thus my questions on the miliage inventory. But if a trail that already sees use is to be taken then it should be able to be used by more than just a few. It dosent have to be for everyone as there are trails for that but it shouldnt exclude a large amount of users of the park as well. The trail corridors at Elbe will allow for multiple lines and the best of both worlds could be had.

 

[Gibby1]

What were talking about at Elbe is taking a allready built trail that despite Gibbys claims does see a lot of use and turning it into something only a few can use.

Really Jim? By WHOM?

I don't know anyone that drives to Elbe to run the Rainier Vista. Until a year or so ago, most people that I know had never even HEARD of the Rainier Vista trail.

We watched traffic on the trail for a while, unofficially. It had grass growing on the trails and much of the upper part of the trail was heavily overgrown due to a lack of use. It was the least used trail in the entire park because it offered very little challenge to just about everyone who used the park and it was so short that it was hardly worth the drive up the road.

There is no loss to the park.

PS, it's already been changed to have the same rating as the Busywild.

Much of that trail does not have options for multiple lines because no one's built by passes - there was never a need or desire to.

Here's the clincher. Most of the users that go to Elbe will still be able to run that trail because most of the users that I see out there, run rigs out there that meet the recommendations. 36" tires, lockers and a winch. So in fact, the trail will be meeting the needs of what are the majority of the users, at that ORV park. It will also accommodate all the full size vehicles.

 

[pokey]

Really Jim? By WHOM?

I don't know anyone that drives to Elbe to run the Rainier Vista. Until a year or so ago, most people that I know had never even HEARD of the Rainier Vista trail.

We watched traffic on the trail for a while, unofficially. It had grass growing on the trails and much of the upper part of the trail was heavily overgrown due to a lack of use. It was the least used trail in the entire park because it offered very little challenge to just about everyone who used the park and it was so short that it was hardly worth the drive up the road.

There is no loss to the park.

PS, it's already been changed to have the same rating as the Busywild.

Much of that trail does not have options for multiple lines because no one's built by passes - there was never a need or desire to.

Here's the clincher. Most of the users that go to Elbe will still be able to run that trail because most of the users that I see out there, run rigs out there that meet the recommendations. 36" tires, lockers and a winch. So in fact, the trail will be meeting the needs of what are the majority of the users, at that ORV park. It will also accommodate all the full size vehicles.

Most recently posted
http://www.nw-wheelers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=39042&highlight=damn+elbe+thread&page=2


We also ran it last fall when we were there (hombres)

 

[Jaydog]

I can drive my wife's two wheel drive tahoe through rainier vista in it's current state.

 

[Fordzuki]

I run it about every third trip out there, it's a good trail as it is, with the exception of the stretch right at the top of the hill.

Is there any way there could be another trail cut to the top from, say, further up the 9 road, making one easy and one hard? From looking at the map, there are no waterways nearby that area. I think that would be the most feasable, and apease both "crowds". That leaves the view from the top for everyone to see, but the way you get there is up to you and your rig.

 

[Corey Y]

So what is the plan to put the rocks on the trail? Rent a 4wd front end loader and excavator for a couple days?

 

[Gibby1]

I run it about every third trip out there, it's a good trail as it is, with the exception of the stretch right at the top of the hill.

Is there any way there could be another trail cut to the top from, say, further up the 9 road, making one easy and one hard? From looking at the map, there are no waterways nearby that area. I think that would be the most feasable, and apease both "crowds". That leaves the view from the top for everyone to see, but the way you get there is up to you and your rig.

We've been told that we're not allowed to increased trail mileage and that we must stay in the trail corridor, so cutting a new trail up the hill is not a feasible option.

 

[Gibby1]

So what is the plan to put the rocks on the trail? Rent a 4wd front end loader and excavator for a couple days?

Couple of ideas...
Heath Moyer had a friend that worked for a demolition company that was very serious about volunteering the time and equipment to do the job. I'd like to have Jaydog at the helm placing the rocks because he's done this before and our club's name is attached to the trail... but if that doesn't work out we can work with whomever is running the equipment.

I have a Case 1150B that getting the engine put back in right now, just waiting on a couple of parts to come in to finish it up. If we need to, that can haul the rocks up and down the trail. I have a friend with a dump truck and a large enough excavator that will work for a reasonable rate and is interested in doing the work.

We can also just rent the equipment if the option to use Heath's friend fall's through. He was at the last Elbe Focus group meeting but I forget to get his contact info. I had Heath's info but I've lost it as well, so if someone could PM me, Heath Moyer's contact info, I'd appreciate it.

 

[CHOP SHOP]

Most recently posted
http://www.nw-wheelers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=39042&highlight=damn+elbe+thread&page=2


We also ran it last fall when we were there (hombres)

Where did I mention the rainer vista? I didnt. If I did it was to say what a gay trail it currently is.



Sometimes the squeky wheel gets the grease, but this one is old and needs to be replaced.

Dont quote my thread and use it to further your agenda that doesnt even make sense. I didnt even talk about running it.:looser:

 

[pokey]

Where did I mention the rainer vista? I didnt. If I did it was to say what a gay trail it currently is.



Sometimes the squeky wheel gets the grease, but this one is old and needs to be replaced.

Dont quote my thread and use it to further your agenda that doesnt even make sense. I didnt even talk about running it.:looser:

Please see post 17, 18 and 20 of your thread. Just because you didnt know where you were dosent mean you wernt on the trail. The only and I mean only agenda I have is keeping trails open.

All of this is moot anyway as I just found out today that the agreement with Nancy and the DNR for the Rainer vista trail describes exactly what I have been talking about anyway.

 

[pokey]

Back on topic and the end of the pissing contest :awesomework:

 

[ain'tstuckjustresting]

No kidding! My ***** hurts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lets just work on making it a trail for peat sake. As of now it's just a steep logging road. Wow so much fun........

I'm all for a rock crawl. I'm excited to get to work.

 

[dirk]

Please expand on what you found out.

I just found out today that the agreement with Nancy and the DNR for the Rainer vista trail describes exactly what I have been talking about anyway.

Are you talking about this?

The trail corridors at Elbe will allow for multiple lines and the best of both worlds could be had.

:eeek: