Six Shooters vs 5th stud

[Flat-Bed_3rd_Gen]

So I was doing pricing for my knuckle upgrades and after pricing out arp studs and 5th stud upgrade it's only $90 cheaper than tg six shooters. I was wondering if anyone has exprience with both. Would i be better off just saving the extra $90 and going tg or just going arp and bobby's 5th stud kit and using the money elsewhere?

Any opions are much appreiciated

Thanks James

 

[zukkev]

What size tire you running???

 

[Flat-Bed_3rd_Gen]

Haha whoops forgot the specs.

I'm running 37s 529s open front and it's more of a trail rig but I play on some rocks every now and then



James

edit: i was pricing out all 16 steering studs, Do I just need the top 8 or all?

 

[trxguy]

i broke a couple studs on my knuckels.. i didn't upgrade to the 6 shooter i still have the 4, i had to helocoil one, the other broken stud was able to be removed.

i replaced TOP 8 studs with the ARP it cost $72 but i havn't had any problems yet.

Bobby Long makes the "L" tab, i guess that is what you are calling the 5th stud... i have seen it on rigs after i did my swap, i have not heard any complaints.

i am running 38.5x15x15 boggers, 5.29s, locked front and rear, drive flange hubs (no locking hubs)

 

[crash2]

Its my beliefe and experiance the 5th stud will hold up nicely to hard abuse.

One nice aspect of that setup is if you "do" ever have a problem be it a failure of the studs or something un-related to it you can easily find replacement parts localy.

 

[trxguy]

Its my beliefe and experiance the 5th stud will hold up nicely to hard abuse.

One nice aspect of that setup is if you "do" ever have a problem be it a failure of the studs or something un-related to it you can easily find replacement parts localy.

if for some reason you do break the ARP stud it is a no question ask lifetime warrenty - Trail Gear

however if one of those studs do break its going to be a biotch to remove from the knuckel

 

[travisyota83]

you could always do the dana 44 9/16th studs with the fifth stud

 

[zukkev]

I haven't done any mods to mine, other than new studs from Toyota when I put it together...but my rig is only 3K lbs too, running 35's!:redneck:
Have seen a couple 6shooters, and helped install a set on one of our member's rigs...seems to be holding up for him just fine! Seen several 5th studs run with no issue, and they've been thru some good abuse!!!
I'd say with your current setup, run the 5th stud and spend the savings somewhere else :awesomework:, or mail it to me!!:fawkdancesmiley:

 

[super samurai]

i made my own 5th stud and am running stock studs for the rest. i make sure and check the torque every other trip out and have had good results. and it only cost me time as i had everything in the garage to do it.
my bud jeremy has the 6 shooters and the pins broke and one bent pretty quick! so he did the trunion elim. kit and it has been good since.
as far as local parts go, you can put a 4 hole arm on the 6 shooter knuckle and you can put a 6 shooter arm on a stock knucle also.

 

[JAWS]

From what ive seen most of the time when you come aross someone on the trail that has broke their steering arm studs. If you look one or to of the studs are rusty on the top. Witch leads me to beleave that they were broke for a while.... If you keep them tight N check them often. You will find any problems before your stranded on the trail.

 

[jprcrpr94]

It seems that most guys that break studs, don't check them very often. I check mine all the time and have yet to break one. That being said, I just got a 5th stud kit from Bobby!:D Nothing like insurance!:awesomework:

 

[Bunk1]

I agree with the checking the torque often, But its a moot point if the studs arnt bottomed out in the knuckle. I wheeled my old toyota with 4 stud hi steer arms(stock toy studs) and 38.5 sx's for a year with no issues.

 

[Mark m.]

I've done the 5th stud and it works good. Six shooters seem to break.

 

[Rix]

I have six shooters, with 20 ARP studs total.
I didn't HAVE knuckles when I did my build, so I said the hell with it and bought the TG kit.

 

[crash2]

if for some reason you do break the ARP stud it is a no question ask lifetime warrenty - Trail Gear

however if one of those studs do break its going to be a biotch to remove from the knuckel

I actually was refering to using stock knuckles and doing the 5th stud conversion more than ARP studs. Breaking a modified stock component is far easier to source a replacememnt locally than trying to deal with a company thats not local.

 

[heep70]

I have been running my stock 4 stud knuckles and recently added a 5th stud. 5.29s locked & 35"s. No issues yet after 4 years (1 year with 5th stud). I do check the touque every so often.

 

[whatthe?]

I ran 4x4 labs high steer (longer than normal hy-steer arms) with ARP studs. Full hydro steering on 37's with no problem but did frequent checks on the torque. Lots of rock crawling.

 

[Flat-Bed_3rd_Gen]

Wells thanks for all the info looks like I'll go with the 5th stud and just keep checking the torque.

 

[XO FAB]

Wells thanks for all the info looks like I'll go with the 5th stud and just keep checking the torque.

I got a 5th stud setup sitting at the shop all ready to go. If your interested in it let me know Jimmy.

 

[POR]

4x4 labs has weld on six shooter plate, I have it on my 85 I'm running 40'' Iroks and punish my truck in the rocks, I Replaced all my studs with stock Toyota studs I've had this set up for a year and half so broken studs and they don't come loose. I think the weld on plates were like $50 I'm very Impressed :D

 

[CHOP SHOP]

4x4 labs has weld on six shooter plate, I have it on my 85 I'm running 40'' Iroks and punish my truck in the rocks, I Replaced all my studs with stock Toyota studs I've had this set up for a year and half so broken studs and they don't come loose. I think the weld on plates were like $50 I'm very Impressed :D

I bet if ya take off the arms and whack that block with a hammer it will fall off.

Unless the studs thread all the way through the knuckle too, I dont see any improvement.

Why not just weld the arms on the knuckle? Cuz the knuckle is cast and not weldeable.:;

4x4 labs should be smart enough to realize thats not a good idea.

The only way that will add ANY strenght is if ya weld it to the knuckle grease filler plug (mild steel) and the steering stop bolts (mild steel).

 

[luggs]

brad i asked bobby when he was welding mine...the 5th stud u weld the nut in side the nukle...bobby welded one handed it to me i broke it off in my hand...then i made a joke and said we otta have tina weld it...he re welded handed it to me ...and i cranked on it ...then put em on been 2 years now..i wheel every day almost.why buy a 6 shooter sept they look cool.weld em after its orenge hot..then throw em in the wood stove..let it burn out then you will have a strong cast weld.crash makes a great point.

 

[WHITE TRASH1]

I bet if ya take off the arms and whack that block with a hammer it will fall off.

Unless the studs thread all the way through the knuckle too, I dont see any improvement.

Why not just weld the arms on the knuckle? Cuz the knuckle is cast and not weldeable.:;

4x4 labs should be smart enough to realize thats not a good idea.

The only way that will add ANY strenght is if ya weld it to the knuckle grease filler plug (mild steel) and the steering stop bolts (mild steel).

You know better than that... Cast steel is VERY weldable if you have half an IQ point left you'd be able to make it stick rather well easily.

 

[luggs]

the word cast dont mean iron...u can also weld cast iron.

 

[CHOP SHOP]

brad i asked bobby when he was welding mine...the 5th stud u weld the nut in side the nukle...bobby welded one handed it to me i broke it off in my hand...then i made a joke and said we otta have tina weld it...he re welded handed it to me ...and i cranked on it ...then put em on been 2 years now..i wheel every day almost.why buy a 6 shooter sept they look cool.weld em after its orenge hot..then throw em in the wood stove..let it burn out then you will have a strong cast weld.crash makes a great point.

I run fifth stup on my rig with no problems. I have done tons of them ofr others, but welding a chunk of threads on the outside of the knuckle is inferior to tacking a nut inside.

A fifth stud relies on the bolt and nut for its strength. The 4x4 labs relies on the weld to CAST IRON, the studs are only as strong as a not so good weld.
welding a nut inside a knuckle is very different.

The nut is bigger than the hole in the knuckle. The weld only keeps the nut form spinning while tightening it up.

The cast will weld, but not well. It takes a proper heating process and nickle rod also. It will still be alot weaker than welding to mild steel.

 

[CHOP SHOP]

You know better than that... Cast steel is VERY weldable if you have half an IQ point left you'd be able to make it stick rather well easily.

There is no such thing as "CAST STEEL"

Nice try. Ask aboout cast steel on pirate!:haha:

steel is steel, iron is iron.

If it cuts clean with a torch its weldable. If its cuts like poop and gives a spark show its not a good idea to weld, its cast.

WT you of all folks should know this. But Ill argue with ya anyways, even if its an easy one.:beer:

 

[CHOP SHOP]

the word cast dont mean iron...u can also weld cast iron.

You can also **** horses. Its not recomemded and it wont give you the same performance as ****ing a hot woman, but hay its cheaper.:D

 

[CHOP SHOP]

Sometimes we forget that because we look up to somebody it doesnt mean they are always right. I hang out at Bob's alot and thought cast steel was real too. Then I got on pirate spouting my "CAST STEEL" knowledge and was quickly schooled.

Bobby is a smart man and I have learned alot from him too. But welding on cast is not a strong alternative.

Here is the thread from when I thought the same as you guys. I was so stubborn and didnt want ot listen to them either. I have a different view of welding on knuckles now. Please look here to learn.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=796819&highlight=

 

[CHOP SHOP]

will you guys believe me if Crash says it?

Its a bad idea IMO.

First the knucles are cast but its not 100% cast steel. I have done many trail repairs where welding the knucle to the arm was needed. I can tell you just based off that I would not unless you are a good welder and know your metal properties. I consider myself a good welder but I would not do it.

 

[WHITE TRASH1]

There is no such thing as "CAST STEEL"

Nice try. Ask aboout cast steel on pirate!:haha:

steel is steel, iron is iron.

If it cuts clean with a torch its weldable. If its cuts like poop and gives a spark show its not a good idea to weld, its cast.

WT you of all folks should know this. But Ill argue with ya anyways, even if its an easy one.:beer:

Google says I'm right :flipoff: Cast steel is just iron with carbon added in and it can be cast. I've always been under the impression that the steering components on yota's are cast steel and the 3rd members, engine blocks etc are cast ductile iron.

Pretty much anything is weldable these days but your torch scenario is a good way to know what is easily weldable by the average joe in his garage. :;

I know factory yota steering arms weld very nicely and don't spit and fall apart like cast iron does when you MIG it..