Yota Cage Idea...Feedback

FullMetalFabworks · Feb 24, 2015

MtnGoat said:
Rokcrler,

See my questions below in the picture. Can you send me the bendtech file for that piece? I would like to benchmark it against what I come up with...this concept (wrap around the back) is the same situation I am facing with mine. Having that piece to load and take measurements against mine would help "Big Time"..

Heres a handy formula and just some general tips for tube bending that help me, especially with clocked tubes with multiple bends like the one that turns in behind the cab:

- Center Line Radius (CLR) X Degree of Bend (DOB) X 0.017453 = Amount of Tubing Used to Make a Bend ( from tangent (start of bend ) to the second tangent (end of bend) )

- For tube with clocked bends, It's easiest to just think of the tube as a circle and since we know a circle has 360 degrees, and we remember awesome formulas from high school like C= (pi)(D), then we know that for a 1.75" tube the circumference = 5.495 ( or 3.14x1.75), so if you have a perfect circle around there tube that is perpindicular ( I have various size tube transfers made for this, but you can just cut a square piece of cardboard and use it as a tube wrapper and get the same effect) 1" around the tube = 65.51 degrees of rotation, 2.75= 180 degrees of rotation, etc

- If you have a tube that has more than a single bend in it, I never start bending anything without first making a "timing" line the entire length of the tube (use a piece of angle iron and a sharpie to make it), then make sure it is lined up with some point on your die (I like mark the center of my follow die with a center punch), that way you have a reference point and if you're bending on the same plane/ without any clocking it, the timing line should line up with the same point on the follow die

- if you go through and do test 90s for all your dies, and each material you will bend with it ( HREW, DOM, 4130, etc all will have different rates of spring back, as will different wall thicknesses in the same material), and get your start of bend offset down it really takes the guess work out of tube bending.

MtnGoat · Feb 24, 2015

FullMetalFabworks said:
Heres a handy formula and just some general tips for tube bending that help me, especially with clocked tubes with multiple bends like the one that turns in behind the cab:

- Center Line Radius (CLR) X Degree of Bend (DOB) X 0.017453 = Amount of Tubing Used to Make a Bend ( from tangent (start of bend ) to the second tangent (end of bend) )

- For tube with clocked bends, It's easiest to just think of the tube as a circle and since we know a circle has 360 degrees, and we remember awesome formulas from high school like C= (pi)(D), then we know that for a 1.75" tube the circumference = 5.495 ( or 3.14x1.75), so if you have a perfect circle around there tube that is perpindicular ( I have various size tube transfers made for this, but you can just cut a square piece of cardboard and use it as a tube wrapper and get the same effect) 1" around the tube = 65.51 degrees of rotation, 2.75= 180 degrees of rotation, etc

- If you have a tube that has more than a single bend in it, I never start bending anything without first making a "timing" line the entire length of the tube (use a piece of angle iron and a sharpie to make it), then make sure it is lined up with some point on your die (I like mark the center of my follow die with a center punch), that way you have a reference point and if you're bending on the same plane/ without any clocking it, the timing line should line up with the same point on the follow die

- if you go through and do test 90s for all your dies, and each material you will bend with it ( HREW, DOM, 4130, etc all will have different rates of spring back, as will different wall thicknesses in the same material), and get your start of bend offset down it really takes the guess work out of tube bending.

That is some good information real good information. I like the cardboard idea...that is new to me and I think I can use that method.

I see what you are talking about..... I will explain my method...it works and could work better but I have been to lazy to make the jig.

Example:

1st Bend Tube 45 degree
2nd Move Tube 6inchs, Rotate Tube 30 degree Bend 45 Degrees.

Basically a compound bend (and my technique might work better with my bender "Rogue"..)

Anyways I just tack a flat piece of steel on the end of tube. I then put my angle finder (digital on it), zero it out. Bend first bend, move tube out, rotate (looking at my angle finder), then bend up.

I have been wanting to make a "Point of Angle" bracket... Steel that can clamp on the tube and stick the angle finder to it for rotation.....(seen the concept in the bend-tech program and thought I need one of them) but there is not such that I know of....

TBItoy · Feb 24, 2015

http://www.trick-tools.com/ALB_Combo_Rotation_Gauge_ALB_Combo_1377#.VO1B_EdOKK0

I have a similar V clamp with a flat to stick my digital angle finder on.

MtnGoat · Feb 24, 2015

TBItoy said:
http://www.trick-tools.com/ALB_Combo_Rotation_Gauge_ALB_Combo_1377#.VO1B_EdOKK0

I have a similar V clamp with a flat to stick my digital angle finder on.

Son of a..... That is exactly what I need. Thank you for posting this...

Toddy · Feb 25, 2015

You could use a beam clamp on end of tube. Pipe fitter have one with a level in it. Beam clamp is like a small c clamp with a screw in it to hold on beam. Most have a flat and tapped hole to hang all thread out of. I'll look and see if I can get a picture of some.

Rokcrler · Feb 25, 2015

Re: Re: Yota Cage Idea...Feedback

Whip up one outta scrap

MtnGoat · Feb 25, 2015

Re: Re: Yota Cage Idea...Feedback

Rokcrler said:
Whip up one outta scrap

Time to get off the lazy train and just make one.... Thanks for the pictures. I should have pone whipped out soon. I got enough crap laying around to make that puppy.

RebelRider · Feb 25, 2015

I know it's a little late, but I'd definetly recommend not doing the front fenders that way. That's the way I worked mine. If you ever want to push the front axle out, you have to basically re-work the entire front cage.

MtnGoat · Feb 25, 2015

RebelRider said:
I know it's a little late, but I'd definetly recommend not doing the front fenders that way. That's the way I worked mine. If you ever want to push the front axle out, you have to basically re-work the entire front cage.

That is a good looking Yota BTW...

Yeah I am already hell bent on what I have so far so I might as well continue on-ward down the road BUT you make a very valid point in regards to the front axle position in future...

-Thanks for sharing!

RebelRider · Feb 25, 2015

MtnGoat said:
That is a good looking Yota BTW...

Yeah I am already hell bent on what I have so far so I might as well continue on-ward down the road BUT you make a very valid point in regards to the front axle position in future...

-Thanks for sharing!

No problem sir. It's just an issue I'm fighting now that I don't have duals. Now that I have a single tcase, I need to push my axle out.
Also keep in mind to your final weld process. I made mine in 2 peices, so I can weld it out before installing.

I'm not trying to preach, just letting you know some of the things I did to make it work.

MtnGoat · Feb 25, 2015

RebelRider said:
No problem sir. It's just an issue I'm fighting now that I don't have duals. Now that I have a single tcase, I need to push my axle out.
Also keep in mind to your final weld process. I made mine in 2 peices, so I can weld it out before installing.

I'm not trying to preach, just letting you know some of the things I did to make it work.

RebelRider,

Thank you for sharing your thoughts and suggestions.
I just ordered my weld in bungs today (206.00) YIKES! I cant believe I did it but I did. I plan to make it removal…so basically the entire cage will sit off. In order to perform the following: Final welding, Paint, and in the future if I knock the front windshield out…
Question: When you did final welding with the cage off the truck…Did you experience a lot draw up on the tubes? I have built mine so tight I am just hoping it does not draw up so bad that it makes contact with body.
I am just curious at how well these exo's hold up when rolled over… I assume they give some and if they do its going to hit the body…ol well hahaha

RebelRider · Feb 25, 2015

Mine is welded solid. No bungs. I figure if it roll it bad enough to bust the windsheild, I'll have to redo the cage.. As far as distorting, I made good tack welds and braced up large gaps such as the doors. I had no problems afters welding.
Unless you are going to put 4" between the cage and body, it will eventually rub in places. Think about it, the cage is welded to the frame and the body is on rubber mounts. My fenders rub the armor at times. I've layed mine on its side a couple times with good results, but only actually rolled it once. It took it pretty well.

Rokcrler · Feb 25, 2015

i built mine, tacked good while building then removed to fully weld.

Added bars as needed

Never broke a windshield, but did intend to install windshield bars.... but i dont wheel hard so... :dunno:

I would only add couplings to key areas and weld in the main supports. For the windshield bars, you could bushing mount them at the top brow and the dash cross bar.
Couplings are nice, but one or two brushes against rocks/trees/flops and they'll be hell to re-install.

MtnGoat · Feb 25, 2015

RebelRider said:
Mine is welded solid. No bungs. I figure if it roll it bad enough to bust the windsheild, I'll have to redo the cage.. As far as distorting, I made good tack welds and braced up large gaps such as the doors. I had no problems afters welding.
Unless you are going to put 4" between the cage and body, it will eventually rub in places. Think about it, the cage is welded to the frame and the body is on rubber mounts. My fenders rub the armor at times. I've layed mine on its side a couple times with good results, but only actually rolled it once. It took it pretty well.

Good deal. I was worried about the draw after welding...(I mig) no fancy tig welding for me...so I burn hot usually.

I agree on the gap...I expect it to rub some with the body movement...I have a body lift and have it clinched down tight to the frame but I still expect movement....regardless I shouldnt mind I just hate for it to look like shotty work you know when people see it if indeed it rubs a raw spot in the body.

Thanks

MtnGoat · Feb 25, 2015

Rokcrler said:
i built mine, tacked good while building then removed to fully weld.

Added bars as needed

Never broke a windshield, but did intend to install windshield bars.... but i dont wheel hard so...

I would only add couplings to key areas and weld in the main supports. For the windshield bars, you could bushing mount them at the top brow and the dash cross bar.
Couplings are nice, but one or two brushes against rocks/trees/flops and they'll be hell to re-install.

NICE..... Like the roll over picture... bet that was fun.

Rokcrler · Feb 25, 2015

Didn't spill my coffee :dblthumb:

MtnGoat · Feb 25, 2015

Rokcrler said:
Didn't spill my coffee

Priceless...I seen that after my comment hahahaha

Markrobinson · Feb 25, 2015

RebelRider said:
Mine is welded solid. No bungs. I figure if it roll it bad enough to bust the windsheild, I'll have to redo the cage.. As far as distorting, I made good tack welds and braced up large gaps such as the doors. I had no problems afters welding.
Unless you are going to put 4" between the cage and body, it will eventually rub in places. Think about it, the cage is welded to the frame and the body is on rubber mounts. My fenders rub the armor at times. I've layed mine on its side a couple times with good results, but only actually rolled it once. It took it pretty well.

Good looking rig!

RebelRider · Feb 25, 2015

Markrobinson said:
Good looking rig!

Thank ya.

MtnGoat,
Putting an X behind the cab will really help a lot as far as strength and movement. You can go ahead and back half it while you have the bender out