Elbe Hills Focus Group

Gibby1 · Jan 10, 2008

mud4funtoy said:
I have a question about those rub rails. When we put them on they were not the ones that were meant for the busy wild bridge. We used 6x8 instead of the 4x4' s because that was some material that we had laying around do to a DNR miss order.
Also the rub rails do not and are not what holds the bridge together. Under the rub rails is angle Iron that holds the planks in. If you go over to the bridge on the sunshine trail there is a bridge with no rub rails and you can see the dynamics's of what holds the planks in. The rub rails are designed to guide the driver as to not fall off the bridge. We have plenty of rub rails and they are designed to be changed.
If we are going to ask for a width restriction we will need to consider the width between the trees and the actual width of the bridge.
Rub rails are designed to be rubbed and driven on if needed.

It's my understanding that the bridges on the Sunrise were a slightly different, and better construction than the ones on the busywild. On the busy, (and I haven't bent over the bridge to look at them) the rub rails are also keeping the planks from sliding back and forth and that there were only anchored in sections. At least that's how I recall Nancy explaining it to me.

mud4funtoy · Jan 10, 2008

Gibby said:
It's my understanding that the bridges on the Sunrise were a slightly different, and better construction than the ones on the busywild. On the busy, (and I haven't bent over the bridge to look at them) the rub rails are also keeping the planks from sliding back and forth and that there were only anchored in sections. At least that's how I recall Nancy explaining it to me.

I with volunteers built the upper sunshine bridge before Nancy ever came along. I helped design those bridges with Jim Blankenship He was 5 Coordinators back. The State of Washington adopted our idea for all recreational trails because we were able to cut the cost of building bridges by 80 % and a life that was 3 times longer. If you want to meet me up there i will show you exactly how the bridges are held together and built. All the materials were bought at the same time. the idea that one is stronger than the other not true. they all have the same materials and design.

Gibby1 · Jan 10, 2008

mud4funtoy said:
I with volunteers built the upper sunshine bridge before Nancy ever came along. I helped design those bridges with Jim Blankenship He was 5 Coordinators back. The State of Washington adopted our idea for all recreational trails because we were able to cut the cost of building bridges by 80 % and a life that was 3 times longer. If you want to meet me up there i will show you exactly how the bridges are held together and built. All the materials were bought at the same time. the idea that one is stronger than the other not true. they all have the same materials and design.

I organized the work parties for the last two Sunrise bridges so I'm very familiar with how they were built. There is something different about the older bridges on the busywild. I'm not going to argue with you about it. I'll just have to have a look next time I'm on the busy.

Gibby1 · Jan 10, 2008

I had a chance to speak with Nancy finally about the option of leaving the busy wide open.

2 concerns she expressed.
1) If they agree that some resource damage is going to happen due to the nature of 4 wheeling, (I specifically mentioned bumping up against trees and digging a root balls) that there would need to be a LOT more maintenance to keept the trails from wandering, which means illegal bypasses being formed. Trail corridors would have to be marked and relatively narrow and there would be NO tolerance of going outside these corridors. Reading into this, we need to COMMITT to a much better volunteer and work schedule that we've done in the past and we are going to have to keep people on the trail, if the agree to this. Sorry CHOP SHOP, but we're going to need people to "tattle" in order to assist with enforcement of people going off the trail, running in the wrong direction etc.
2) It is possible to find an old trail or road to make in a SWB trail and decommission another trail, such as the mainline but there are some glitches i that. First, we still have to look at the eco feasibility of that new trail and it's not quite to so easy to decommission a trail if that trail is used to access other trails... Nancy can explain in more detail. It is feasible, but tricky.

These are the type of compromises that come into play. They can accept the resource damage to the areas INSIDE an established and marked trail corridor but the trails cannot wander and bypasses simply cannot happen. I'd suggest VERY stiff fines to those who do and we need to be willing to self police.

Just some thoughts going into the meeting.

See ya there!