zukkev
Cornfuzzled yet again...
There ARE trails in the plan, which I will not even attempt----my rig's too short! Do ya hear me bitchin'????:flipoff::kiss:
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zukkev
Cornfuzzled yet again...
:eeek:.....:flipoff:......:booo:
100% AGREED !!!! :beer: :beer:
My post was not aimed at wheelers like yourself that enjoy the REAL facts about wheeling.....
My post was more aimed at the cry babies that cry their trails are getting too hard and they can no longer make it because of people like myself that have bigger rigs and so in return they get our trails that are meant for all of us to use shut down to only people that fit in this made up criteria..... :stirpot:
Just pisses me off that they think they are some how more special and deserve it more then the next guy ???? :Stoned:
Holy chit where did you get this from:eeek: Please be specific and tell us short narrow guys EXACTLY which trails WE got closed down to bigger rigs. I really want to know
Binder
Well-Known Member
Part of the draw to tight SWB trails is that there is little room to navigate them. Yes you have to drive them and it requires skill. Make them wide then skill is no longer required.
There are aspects of four wheeling that challenges drivers other than just simply trying to make a obstacle.:awesomework:
crash2
-Oh no I picked a side-
I personally love the concept of a certain trail built for a certain user and binder nailed it perfectly...
We have already tried this and know it doesn't work. If you make the first section of the trail hard to keep lesser equipped rigs out the twice-a-year wheelers will pave it. The rape of the 311 trail is a perfect example.
As a wheeler who wheeled Reiter exclusively almost every weekend this does bother me, and NOT because I don't think small rigs should have their own trails. With one exception (Warjeeper) I never saw narrow short wheel base rigs at the old Reiter. Reiter was a utopia for hardcore rigs and buggies, all shod with large tires. A place where those who genuinely got off on the craft of technical rock crawling could live their dreams. There are no other areas (legally or publicly open) in Washington state where this is possible.
Not a peep was heard from the Korean War era rigs while we were still wheelin Reiter and the threat of its closure was on the table. No support whatsoever. Now here we are designing whole trails for those who couldn't be bothered in the first place. You can already wheel 95% of the trails in Washington without spilling your beer in a spring under 33 inch tired 60 year old flatty. That crowd is more than taken care of.
I wonder if I can comment to DNR again? Do they not see the Rock Garden or the Outlet Mall? What we want is right there in front of them.
Ty.
Well-Known Member
It will work. You have seen NoWires ideas, and they are good. The 311 is a terrible example. That was a gay trail, that they decided to gay up the almost fun entrance to. It was done by the forest service, and their volunteers. The gatekeepers at Reiter are part of the trail design. Nobody will come in later, in any official capacity, and "pave them."
As far as not catering just to little rigs, you won't hear an argument from me. You are right they already have trails. Like NoWires said if you can make it through the gatekeeper you are golden. That should apply to the tight trails too IMO.:;
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olywa
Well-Known Member
Well if I'm not mistaken all of Evans Creek is now being enforced as a SWB only with barriers set at the width anyone over that can no longer go down......
I know it always has been but nothing was ever done about it, but everytime I would go out there in a wide rig all the SWB guys would be right there Bitchin the whole time .....
Yeah I get this now you want skills take my 89" wide rig down that same trail and make it....now that takes skills....... :redneck: :fawkdancesmiley:
All I was trying to say on the whole thing is that if there is a trail that is going to be used for 4x4 rigs then all of them should be able to use it not the select few that fit in there made up criteria...... Especially if we are going to build a whole new system... then lets get it right so everyone can use it or at least given the option maybe like the purple trails are for recommended 86" and smaller given the choice we probably don't wanna be on the girlie trails anyways, but still should get a choice if we want to or not... not be restricted....... :fawkdancesmiley: :fawkdancesmiley:
The more I think about it it is a good idea, so that way all the little rigs can go up on their purple trails and keep off the big boy trails, keeping them from getting all cluttered with stuck and broke rigs that should not have been out there in the first place......... Nothing worse then going down a trail and waiting for the little pee wee rigs to winch themselves out so the rest can just go right thru it.... :fawkdancesmiley: :fawkdancesmiley:
That is the idea of them having their purple trails. It's give and take, we have our harder obstacles designed for bigger rigs, they get their smaller trails. Ultimately, I agree with Horus, though.
Binder
Well-Known Member
I hope you know that you're preaching to the choir here.:;
crash2
-Oh no I picked a side-
Reiter is dead and gone and we need to get over it and look ahead. Bringing up the past does us no good. Anger does us no good unless it can be turned into something constructive.
The whole plan is a compromise and if we want "anyplace" new to play we need to learn to compromise--thats just the way it is and going to be in this new world.
As for short wheelbase rigs I saw them allot--not only on the trails but on the highway heading there.
olywa
Well-Known Member
100% AGREED.... IMO We just need to leave all restrictions out of it and keep it open to all that want to play....... With restrictions or with out, I'll be happy just to get it open and be able to wheel my POS on the land and have a good time......
Yeah I know but even the choir needs a preaching ever once in a while.... :redneck:
NotSoPC
Well-Known Member
Being that I wheel a SWB rig (first time sense I started wheeling) I must say that telling the bigger rigs they can't hit some trails, but letting the SWB rigs run a muck is not fair. I must also say what in life is. Deal with it, and move on. I wont be able to hit the SWB trails by time they are open and I get up there cause I will be going to 101" wheel base next winter.
I dont bitch about the bigger rigs cause it is fun to watch them and I my self was one to wheel a K5 at Evans. The one that were an issue at Evans were the ones who made no attempt at fitting but rather would just blazz cause they could. Those guys are the ones to be pissed at. Not the SWB guys.:beer:
I dont bitch about the bigger rigs cause it is fun to watch them and I my self was one to wheel a K5 at Evans. The one that were an issue at Evans were the ones who made no attempt at fitting but rather would just blazz cause they could. Those guys are the ones to be pissed at. Not the SWB guys.:beer:
You are sooooo right those little rigs neverrrr used reiter at all
and of course nobodyyyyy from the little tire crowd everrrrr had anything to do with keeping reiter open or funded (read timber tamers, Arlene Brooks Just as a example) I just love posts like this that are based on knowing all of the facts beyond what can be seen with blinders on :booo:So again Horus I suppose you would have rather seen the 311 closed to everybody instead of doing what the forest service required in order to keep the trail open :eeek:
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Binder
Well-Known Member
There's a reason you never saw the SWB rigs at Reiter towards the end. It's because what was once trails was turned into a huge pile of **** that was no fun for a SWB rig to be on. That's what happens when there's no rules and everyone drives what they want and where they want....I think we're trying to learn from our mistakes here.:cheer:
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Your still skirting the issue. You claimed it was the short narrow rigs that made this happen. Please show me the proff of this. Fact is and most of us know this it was the FS that decided to enforce a rule that they had previously ignored. It was my work and the backing of our membership that convinced them to open up the width from the posted 72" to 80" so more people would be able to use the system. Im sorry There was nobody at the table that I saw trying with any real effort to get anything wider. so I have to ask where were you in this process :eeek:
crash2
-Oh no I picked a side-
I don't understand what you mean by run a muck.
olywa
Well-Known Member
I think everything could be solved and everyone or close to it be happy is just in the changing of the wording, from restricted to recommended .....
I think you will see that people will be happy cause no one likes rules that are only aimed at one select crowd..... and we will more then likely see that the bigger rigs will not want to be going down the tight trails anyways....as I stated before I can make it, but why .... it is way too much work for me to squeeze my rig through there when I could be attempting some bad a** obstacle..... That is why I wheel is to make the impossible - not ***** foot thru the forest on a Sunday afternoon drive.....
Just to put the shoe on the other foot real quick.....
Say we Take and close Elbe to all SWB rigs that are 86" and under and place pilings and obstacles to keep the SWB's out and only guys with 40" + tires can go, now would that be fair and all you SWB guys would be okay with that ....
Not saying that it is a good idea but you can kinda feel where I'm coming from especially what happened at Evans Creek.......
I think you will see that people will be happy cause no one likes rules that are only aimed at one select crowd..... and we will more then likely see that the bigger rigs will not want to be going down the tight trails anyways....as I stated before I can make it, but why .... it is way too much work for me to squeeze my rig through there when I could be attempting some bad a** obstacle..... That is why I wheel is to make the impossible - not ***** foot thru the forest on a Sunday afternoon drive.....
Just to put the shoe on the other foot real quick.....
Say we Take and close Elbe to all SWB rigs that are 86" and under and place pilings and obstacles to keep the SWB's out and only guys with 40" + tires can go, now would that be fair and all you SWB guys would be okay with that ....
Not saying that it is a good idea but you can kinda feel where I'm coming from especially what happened at Evans Creek.......
olywa
Well-Known Member
Well time I heard about this is too late.....blah blah blah......That's not the point if you had so much influence then why did you not speak for all of us instead of just for your group, leaving the rest of us out to hang...... We are all suppose to be a family or a united group as one...... seems in some issues we still be divided in to separate groups.... I guess I'll have to stay more in tune with the things going on and start looking out for the wider guys, since others will not apparently do so on all our parts.....
