NOVA Grants

[WA-Wheeler]

They are winning because to a degree they are right. In this day an age when the environment is on the minds of hundreds of millions it is tough to compete especially when fighting for a sport that essentially destroys the environment (not going to argue logistics). But as an American it is our right to use our land (public or private) the way we want but we need restrictions. Chaos is the son of lawlessness.

If we open a quarrel between past and present, we shall find that we have lost the future.
-Winston Churchill

 

[Horus]

Very good.

The next step now is damage. How do the standards we are held to by the DNR and FS compare to those of the logging and mining industries? One of the best comparisons I can make is the comparison between a 4X4 trail through the woods and a freeway or housing development. The damage a hiking trail causes to the environment may be marginally less than that of a 4X4 trail but add up the thousands of miles of hiking trails in the state and you have a case for making hiking a criminal offense.

We cause damage to the environment, yes. Taken as a whole our footprint falls far short of the environmental haterape conducted by loggers, miners and hikers with the DNR and FS's blessing. Next time you are at Evans note the destruction right behind the campground. Nothing at Reiter could even begin to compare to what a logging skidder does to Bambi's home.

Next time you see a logging truck going down the highway next to you note the condition of the trees it is hauling. No amount of 4X4 damage comes close to the damage those resources experience by the time they are loaded up and leaving the forest.

When you compare the damage we create pursuing life, liberty and happiness to the damage DNR creates with logging contracts one fact is made very clear. ORV users are being forced into the back of the bus because of who we are as people. Environmentalism is only a word being used by the DNR and FS as a cover for facism.

Mr Churchhill is dead right. Because we are voluntarily destroying the achievements of our past now, we are signing off our future.

 

[Ty.]

There was a time when racial segregation was just the way it is. There was also a time in this land when American colonists would put a significant amount of their wealth onto boats bound for England in the form of taxes. When they first arrived in the new world it was so simple. A generation later the new taxes being levied against the Americans by the king of England were crippling.

During those time a few people stood up and suggested this new world should become it's own new nation, an American nation.

These few people had one major obstacle and that was all the people around them. Most people back then would say things like "We can't stop paying the King's tax or they'll close everything anyway" or " we have to help the King pave our trails into irrelevance, or else". After all, we can't fight the red coats and win. That'll never happen.

The whole reason we are here now and the "glory days" are gone is because we allowed them to take our freedom away. Rather than stand up for what is American we shovel the Kings gravel into the King's trail hoping we might have access to the King's forest for a few more years. It is not the King's forest.

This is America, Land of the Free. To use an environmental law to subvert unalienable human rights is a crime as high as murder. We are losing our trails to gravel and closure because we have turned into a nation of pushovers. Government says jump, we ask how high.

My point in this thread is that I want to turn this fight around, not help the greenies end it for us. We, ORV users say bullshit like its hopeless and we just have to play by the king's rules. On Greenie forums they are saying "Yes, we're winning, we're winning! Fighting for what we want like real Americans IS WORKING! "

Yup, all this 100 percent. Except the Greenies aren't real Americans, they are scumbags that don't like our freedoms.

We need to fight any usurpers of our founding principles.

We are the Offroad Militia

 

[WA-Wheeler]

:awesomework: :awesomework: :awesomework:

 

[dirk]

When you compare the damage we create pursuing life, liberty and happiness to the damage DNR creates with logging contracts one fact is made very clear. ORV users are being forced into the back of the bus because of who we are as people. Environmentalism is only a word being used by the DNR and FS as a cover for facism.

Just wanted to say thank you for speaking your mind & getting involved :beer:

 

[Horus]

Let me share something with you all. Of all the amendments in our Bill Of Rights, this one is my favorite. The Ninth Amendment in our Bill Of Rights.

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others held by the people.

The bottom line is simple. Four Wheel Drive users do not want anything from anyone except the freedom to pursue our happiness. We do what we do far away from anyone uninvolved in what we do. We do not take from anyone, nor do we hurt or risk hurting anyone. The "damage" we cause to the environment is irrelevant when compared to other sanctioned forest industries. The "damage" we cause is irrelevant when weighed against the amount of liberty and happiness it brings to those who partake as well as the economic benefits it brings towns near OVR areas as well as the State overall when our buggies are built.

It is flat the **** out unconstitutional to bar us as free taxpayers access to OUR lands. I cannot be more plain than this. To single out ORV users and oppress our rights whilst turning a blind eye to logging and mining operations, fishermen, hunters, hikers and other forest driven recreationists is cultural segregation.

We, ORV users are being told "our type" are allowed only in the back most seats of the bus and that only certain water fountains are acceptable for our use. Our struggle is no different than the many struggles for equality we see throughout our history.

Just wanted to say thank you for speaking your mind & getting involved :beer:

You're welcome.

 

[Anthony1]

Let me share something with you all. Of all the amendments in our Bill Of Rights, this one is my favorite. The Ninth Amendment in our Bill Of Rights.

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others held by the people.

The bottom line is simple. Four Wheel Drive users do not want anything from anyone except the freedom to pursue our happiness. We do what we do far away from anyone uninvolved in what we do. We do not take from anyone, nor do we hurt or risk hurting anyone. The "damage" we cause to the environment is irrelevant when compared to other sanctioned forest industries. The "damage" we cause is irrelevant when weighed against the amount of liberty and happiness it brings to those who partake as well as the economic benefits it brings towns near OVR areas as well as the State overall when our buggies are built.

It is flat the **** out unconstitutional to bar us as free taxpayers access to OUR lands. I cannot be more plain than this. To single out ORV users and oppress our rights whilst turning a blind eye to logging and mining operations, fishermen, hunters, hikers and other forest driven recreationists is cultural segregation.

We, ORV users are being told "our type" are allowed only in the back most seats of the bus and that only certain water fountains are acceptable for our use. Our struggle is no different than the many struggles for equality we see throughout our history.





You're welcome.

:awesomework:

 

[sideshow1]

This should be a bumper-sticker.

Guilty until proven hiker.

Horus, I owe you a :beer:, thanks for speaking your mind and inspiring me.

 

[Horus]

So How many miles have we lost Horus ? By this I mean of legal trails ?

Roughly 400 yards of legal trail were closed and turned into roadway this previous weekend, according to a source present at the Kaner Trail Depreciation Day work party. Legal trail lost forever.

 

[CHOP SHOP]

Im in support of ALL trails legal or NOT.

When asking for permission gets you NOWHERE,

Start thinking of how to DEMAND forgiveness.

 

[dirk]

This should be a bumper-sticker.

Guilty until proven hiker.

It does have a ring to it :haha:

 

[pokey]

Roughly 400 yards of legal trail were closed and turned into roadway this previous weekend, according to a source present at the Kaner Trail Depreciation Day work party. Legal trail lost forever.

From My "source"

Your "source" says, 400 yards of trail reality is more like 300, also 200 yards of trail were made legal (existing braid that reroute took place on) Also almost 1/4 mile of closed road was opened to trail traffic only.(road to trail conversion) This amounts to a net loss of trail of 100 yards or less but amounts in a gross gain of trail overall. Trail now has drainage and infrastructure in place that will help keep trail from having maintaence issues and therfore will remain open instead of being closed for good.

Sounds like a win to me. Thanks to all who did the work to keep this trail open :awesomework:

 

[sideshow1]

It does have a ring to it :haha:

Right? Do it and put me down for 5 :corn:

 

[dirk]

Also almost 1/4 mile of closed road was opened to trail traffic only.(road to trail conversion) This amounts to a net loss of trail of 100 yards or less but amounts in a gross gain of trail overall. Trail now has drainage and infrastructure in place that will help keep trail from having maintaence issues and therfore will remain open instead of being closed for good.

So...we lost some trail, but saw an overall increase to "trail mileage". What kind of enhancements did they make during the road to trail conversion? I have little interest in wheeling a bunch of gravel covered FS roads...taking a road and calling it a trail does not constitute as a win in my book.

I'm betting Horus feels the same.

 

[dirk]

Right? Do it and put me down for 5 :corn:

Hmmm...I wonder if John's sticker guy could run a few?

 

[sideshow1]

Hmmm...I wonder if John's sticker guy could run a few?

Ill send him a PM........

 

[Horus]

Ill send him a PM........

Now I'm excited. :awesomework:

 

[pokey]

So...we lost some trail, but saw an overall increase to "trail mileage". What kind of enhancements did they make during the road to trail conversion? I have little interest in wheeling a bunch of gravel covered FS roads...taking a road and calling it a trail does not constitute as a win in my book.

I'm betting Horus feels the same.

The "win" is in keeping the trail open for all of us to use. True its not what it was but isn't that better than being closed ? If you really want someone to bash on for this whole thing then go after the irresponsible users that tore the crap out of this trail and many others that's where the real problem is.
By keeping this trail open it allows the use by non street legal rigs (like yours) to continue using it. If it hadnt been fixed and rerouted then it would have made it illegal for you to access the area by trail forcing you onto to roads where you could be ticketed. So while this may not be a "ideal" fix to you, you still benifit from it.

 

[pokey]

Roughly 400 yards of legal trail were closed and turned into roadway this previous weekend, according to a source present at the Kaner Trail Depreciation Day work party. Legal trail lost forever.

http://www.nw-wheelers.com/forum/showpost.php?p=952466&postcount=9

 

[benw1]

So...we lost some trail, but saw an overall increase to "trail mileage". What kind of enhancements did they make during the road to trail conversion? I have little interest in wheeling a bunch of gravel covered FS roads...taking a road and calling it a trail does not constitute as a win in my book.

I'm betting Horus feels the same.

The only obstacle that was lost is a wetland/mudhole that had a bridge over it. The rest is pretty much even on the difficulty scale (2wd easy).