LS or SBC
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patooyee
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zr2x350 said:
In rock crawling? I agree. In motor sports in general though there will always be a place for big blocks. As we all know, there is no replacement for displacement given all other factors being equal. I, if you put the same junk and tuning into a 350 CID motor as you do a 454, the 454 will always be more powerful. Yes, you can get 454CID out of LS motors but for cost is no factor 600+ CID, there simply is no substitute for BBC's.
J. J.
tbacon38
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Thanks for clearing up the ls or sbc deal did not see that in the ***le of the thread, I will keep my OBSOLETE never have I been impressed with the "new generation" of motors guess im to old school. In off roading (rock crawling, hill shooting, nasty ledges, etc....) when you need the power on the bottom instead of at 3500 or wherever you gotta have torque not once in this entire LS OR SBC thread have i seen that mentioned, and what makes torque a big block, who cares about hp when you got 4 44 inch tires on the ground torque is what is going to move them not hp. Everybody thinks a buggy that is sitting there on a hill twisting 9000 is a bad sum ***** but look at the tire speed hell i can count the lug nuts as they come around. With that being said if this guy is in a place where they produce 500 hp SBCs then thats what I would go with for a quick and cheap way to get on the trailpatooyee said:
tbacon38
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DING DING DING DING Johhny maybe heres your answer why GM went away from the big block so they could advertise the ratings to draw more people to buy there vehicles. But why would anybody pull with a gas burner anyways 7.3 powerstroke all the way, I know what your thinking i preach on bbcs but pull with a ford just dont like the Gm 1 ton trucks sorry.Elliott said:
patooyee
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454tbacon said:
I don't think it stands for anything. LS1, 2, etc is the RPO code for vehicles that came with that engine. All the Gen III / Gen IV engines have just become known by that nomenclature because they share the same architecture though. For instance, LQ9 is the RPO code for the high output 6.0 iron block engine, LQ4 for the lower output 6.0. Most still refer to them as LS engines though because the blocks are nearly identical, all the same parts fit, and most everything is the same compared to a true LS engine. All TRUE LS RPO codes have aluminum blocks though. (LS1, 2, 3, 6, 7, 9. They even have an aluminum block FWD engine cousin that is an LS4.)
And these engines aren't just all high end power. Look up some of he stock dyno graphs for the LS engines. The torque comes on just as early and strong as the big blocks. That's why everyone compares them to them.
I'm not the one who determined that BBC's are obsolete, GM did and stopped making them as a result. You think it was just to look good on paper? You think if they replaced it with a **** engine their customers wouldn't notice and stop buying vehicles? You think that's a decision they made lightly? Like some dude just showed up to work one day and was like, "You know, to really **** with our customers we should stop putting good engines in our vehicles and instead put crappy ones in. Ones that are super cheap to make and don't perform at all. But we'll tell them that they are awesome and they'll never know the difference!" And then everyone else there was like, "Hey, good idea Bob! That'll be hilarious!"
Why do you think GM is STILL the king of production V8's? Why don't you see thousands upon thousands of modern Ford or Dodge engines going into custom vehicles, buggies, sand rails, etc? Why has NASCAR decided to use the LS architecture as the standard in some of their classes and not any of the others?
Like I keep saying, there is a place for BBC's still. But in terms of efficiency, they pale in comparison to LS. And I don't just refer to fuel economy as efficiency. Efficiency is also power per pound of engine and power per cubic inch, both of which LS DESTROYS BBC and SBC. I think the main question is power per dollar spent, which is what I think is debatable.
J. J.
PS: You're not pissing me off. I am trying not to do so to you also. I'd run a BBC in a vehicle where I wanted lots of power, didn't care about weight, and didn't have a lot of money to spend.
tbacon38
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But your telling me I cant go and buy a gm crate big block or they just stop putting them in dds just want to clear this up looked on there site and they still advertise them.tbacon38 said:Yeah man lots of typing on that one hollar at me when you get your buggy done maybe we can shoot a few hills and do a real world comparision.
C
CSMITH
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I've got a forklift with a Big Block on Propane that i use on the farm 
Y
yankster
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tbacon38 said:
Yea they're only nixxing them in production vehicles. GM stills sells crate 350s and they've been off the assembly for 10 years now. Crazy thing is a Ramjet 350 is about the same price as an LS1 after you buy the electronics, and weigh nearly 100 lbs less. I love me some small block but when buying a new crate engine LS wins on price and weight.
http://store.gmperformanceparts.com/store/gmDealerResult.jsp
http://store.gmperformanceparts.com/store/gmDealerResult.jsp
Great thread. Either way you look at it, both type of motors put out great horsepower and can be built for longevity. Just like the age old question "Ford vs Chevrolet", this will never be agreed upon by everyone. 
T
traveler
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hell yeaElliott said:
Big Block tube buggy
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heard Robby Bobby runs a 2 cylinder john deere popper in yellow bird :afro:
Cole said:
This is very true. Apples for apples, the LS will come out cheaper in the end. Sure you can cut corners on a SBC and run a carb or propane, but if you want a 500hp fuel injected motor it is going to cost you. I bought a 6.0 with 30k miles for $1,000.00. Added custom headers/exhaust, used LS hot cam with springs, car intake/tb, and brand new harness and computer and had it all dyno tuned. With 39"s I put right at 300hp to the wheels, that is over 400hp to the crank. All said I have $3k in it. I can add L92 heads and bigger intake and have it tuned again and probably make close to 500hp at the crank. I just don't need it, my motor screams. It replaced a 96 Vortec 350 and the difference is night and day. The main reason I switched was reliability though, my old Vortec 350 was leaning out and fouling plugs every trip. I added a cam to it and nobody could tune it to make it work worth a damn.
patooyee
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tbacon38 said:Yeah man lots of typing on that one hollar at me when you get your buggy done maybe we can shoot a few hills and do a real world comparision.
I'm not sure that an 8000 rpm drag racing big block would be a fair comparison to a measly stock 400hp LS2 but I look forward to wheeling again more than anyone.
The last "production" big block was made in Tonowanda (sp?) in 2009. I don't know what that means for GM Performance Crate engines. It means that you will never see a big block in a production vehicle again though.
J. J.
