To auto or not to auto

ain'tstuckjustresting · Dec 18, 2015

I always heard guys complain about going down hill with autos and not having compression braking. I have no idea what mods go into building a good wheeling trans but whatever Will did to mine has been great for trails. I can go down toboggan hill on the Busywild at 2mph and never touch the brakes. I don't have a fancy reverse manual valvebody or anything special other than an Art Carr shifter with the N-3 gate removed so I can go F to R quickly.

crazybluerider1 · Dec 18, 2015

ain'tstuckjustresting said:
I always heard guys complain about going down hill with autos and not having compression braking. I have no idea what mods go into building a good wheeling trans but whatever Will did to mine has been great for trails. I can go down toboggan hill on the Busywild at 2mph and never touch the brakes. I don't have a fancy reverse manual valvebody or anything special other than an Art Carr shifter with the N-3 gate removed so I can go F to R quickly.

Same with mine. When I click mine into first gear it will damn near throw you threw the windshield. It does have a custom shift kit from PATC but I don't think there is anything fancy done to it.

jimpaget · Dec 18, 2015

The first time out in my rig I discovered that the brakes weren't up to the combination of TF99, 4:1 in the transfer case and 5:38s in the axles. Had to convert the rear drums to disc and then everything was fine. Before the rear discs it would pull through the brakes on a steep downhill. Like everything, I suppose, the whole system has to work together. Wouldn't give up the auto now for anything.

Clark · Dec 19, 2015

I have a stock 2004 Lq9 6.0l tourque converter, th350, 3.8:1, 5.38's, 39's. It does push a little in 1st on really steep slow crawl down hill, that's with manual spidertrax brakes, but i usually just slap it in 2nd and it holds fine.

dobber · Dec 20, 2015

Th350 and a winters shifter with gate cut. Easy to use on the trails and quick 1st to reverse. Has made me happy for the last 9 years. Tranny temp does get hot when I'm doing lots of slow hard crawls but I just have a cheap cooler.

alstick · Dec 21, 2015

I went from a AX 15 behind my 302 to a C4 auto. The C4 was well built full reverse manual. It was a natural fit for the Ford engine. I thought at first I ruined my Jeep. Completely hated the trans the first trip to Moab the C4 had no engine braking so on the brakes all the time downhill. After learning how to two foot the brake & gas to control the 400HP I got better at driving it but the C4 turned out to be a turd. So I recently parted out that rig and have a 6.0L and a 4L80E. having the lock up converter will be way better and having overdrive back will be a godsend for 5.13 or taller gears like I was running with 40s.
So I miss having a stick, Ive been wheeling a stick since 1993. But I've learned to like crawling with an auto (on the fence for snow still) but really need a bigger stronger trans that even that built C4 could manage for a mildly beefed small block. No more full manual for me but I will have a trans controller to manage lock up and shift points.

PORTER · Dec 22, 2015

alstick said:
I went from a AX 15 behind my 302 to a C4 auto. The C4 was well built full reverse manual. It was a natural fit for the Ford engine. I thought at first I ruined my Jeep. Completely hated the trans the first trip to Moab the C4 had no engine braking so on the brakes all the time downhill. After learning how to two foot the brake & gas to control the 400HP I got better at driving it but the C4 turned out to be a turd. So I recently parted out that rig and have a 6.0L and a 4L80E. having the lock up converter will be way better and having overdrive back will be a godsend for 5.13 or taller gears like I was running with 40s.
So I miss having a stick, Ive been wheeling a stick since 1993. But I've learned to like crawling with an auto (on the fence for snow still) but really need a bigger stronger trans that even that built C4 could manage for a mildly beefed small block. No more full manual for me but I will have a trans controller to manage lock up and shift points.

Sounds like you chose a drag race valve body with no compression braking. Most drag racing valve bodies are not ideal for wheeling use as they neutral out after you let off the gas.

TreeClimber · Dec 22, 2015

alstick said:
I went from a AX 15 behind my 302 to a C4 auto. The C4 was well built full reverse manual. It was a natural fit for the Ford engine. I thought at first I ruined my Jeep. Completely hated the trans the first trip to Moab the C4 had no engine braking so on the brakes all the time downhill. After learning how to two foot the brake & gas to control the 400HP I got better at driving it but the C4 turned out to be a turd. So I recently parted out that rig and have a 6.0L and a 4L80E. having the lock up converter will be way better and having overdrive back will be a godsend for 5.13 or taller gears like I was running with 40s.
So I miss having a stick, Ive been wheeling a stick since 1993. But I've learned to like crawling with an auto (on the fence for snow still) but really need a bigger stronger trans that even that built C4 could manage for a mildly beefed small block. No more full manual for me but I will have a trans controller to manage lock up and shift points.

Was wondering what you were building. Where's the rest of the build thread? Aqualu body? TJ style? Or, is it one of those FJ bodies you sent me a picture of?

Also, you going to Idaho on the 9th? If so, see you there.

Tony

whatthe? · Dec 22, 2015

I have a 4.3/th350/toy duals in my runner and it's a great combo. I like manuals in my 4 poppers but a v6 or bigger gets an auto,

ain'tstuckjustresting · Dec 22, 2015

If anyone is looking, there was a good deal on FB today. TH350/Topshift case in Marysville for $175. Can't even buy just the adapter for that.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1665149940391437&set=gm.913199418794724&type=3&theater

Big Rick · Dec 22, 2015

The same question I've been struggling with for a few years now. I have a good stout manual trans in an early bronco, and have always wheeled toyota pick ups with manuals so I don't know any other way. But when I see a friend with an auto in there wheeler I always want to ask, Would you mind if I test out the automatic style of wheeling? but I never do.

Glenn · Dec 23, 2015

Big Rick said:
The same question I've been struggling with for a few years now. I have a good stout manual trans in an early bronco, and have always wheeled toyota pick ups with manuals so I don't know any other way. But when I see a friend with an auto in there wheeler I always want to ask, Would you mind if I test out the automatic style of wheeling? but I never do.

Why not? You might be surprised.

Totalled · Dec 23, 2015

I've had both in the same rig. Auto allows more finesse, and is more forgiving in terms of gearing. IMO, it's more controlled. And my left leg doesn't cramp up after a day of wheeling.

Jwredneck · Dec 24, 2015

Glenn said:
Why not? You might be surprised.

BigRick is known to smash the skinny pedal. It's more likely no one will let him try their auto:fawkdancesmiley:

Harvester of Sorrow · Dec 27, 2015

cisco · Dec 27, 2015

If I had a rig and put an auto in it, I'd also want to make sure it had non power brakes. The idea of being on top of a crazy steep obstacle with an auto and power brakes and having the engine die / run out of gas whatever. At least with a manual you could leave it in gear and brake with the clutch.

[YT]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-Xw_-n1avU[/YT]

junkyard jim · Dec 28, 2015

Lockup converter with a manual override for downhills.

Glenn · Dec 28, 2015

cisco said:
If I had a rig and put an auto in it, I'd also want to make sure it had non power brakes. The idea of being on top of a crazy steep obstacle with an auto and power brakes and having the engine die / run out of gas whatever. At least with a manual you could leave it in gear and brake with the clutch.

[YT]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-Xw_-n1avU[/YT]

What makes you think non-power brakes will stop anyone on that hill?

cisco · Dec 28, 2015

Glenn said:
What makes you think non-power brakes will stop anyone on that hill?

This happened a while back and from what I remember, the engine died so the rig lost its brakes. A good purely hydraulic brake system will apply the same amount of brake force as one with power brakes.