Toyota drive flange failure

Rjhoward32006 · Jun 14, 2016

I keep shearing the 8mm studs and 5/16 dial pins holding the drive flange on front axle.
I dont think the arp's will make a damn. For those who dont know there are 6 studs and 6 dial pins. 12 in total.
Seen where alot of guys drill the cone washer part out and run six 7/16-20 fine thread bolts and the majority do not fail. Most of these guys are running stock lockouts with chromo gears which i normally explode. Yes i'm hard on ****. I didnt like how much material was going to be left in the hub after drilling to a 7/16.
Soooo i went with 3/8-24 one size smaller bolt and put 12 of them instead. The 3/8 bolt is about the same size hole as the smallsst part of the cone washer. So on six of these bolts still have the cone in the drive flange the other six i simply drilled out. I tried to drill out factory cone washers to fit the 3/8 bolt but it dosent work.
Do you think it will hold the way it is or any suggestions?

KPatterson · Jun 14, 2016

1 tons=fixed

Rjhoward32006 · Jun 14, 2016

Hahaha NO!!! :JRich:

i have the theme song " I will survive" playing on repeat for my toyota to get the idea :stir:

smbroady82 · Jun 14, 2016

its worth a shot

I think you and I were talking about this at MM the other weekend.

I broke several sets of the ARPs and got fed up with it. oh and FYI for anyone that doesn't know , ARP WILL NOT warranty the studs if you do not send them in. Idk about the rest of you, but when I broke them in creek beds, I didn't have the best of luck finding them...

. Understandable I suppose, but good luck finding them when they go..

I upgraded to the TG hubs and didn't have any issues, I like the idea of the newer Longfield studless hubs but they aren't cheap.

Tons it was for me and I will never look back. My 2c... Carry on

Rjhoward32006 · Jun 14, 2016

yes i would love to have the studless but they are coin.

TBItoy · Jun 14, 2016

Re:

That shouldn't break. Keep em tight.

Anything will break when they get loose.

tonybolton · Jun 14, 2016

Re:

Looks kinda blingy with all that gooooooooooooolld.

clemsonjeep · Jun 14, 2016

GREAT...perfect timing. I just ordered RCV flanges last week and they'll be here tomorrow. I've been wheeling my rig since 2009 and never had an issue until one of the past rides I came back and had to replace an axle seal. I found out that I had broken the outer hub gear in my IFS hubs. So I had to make a decision...spend $99 on the chromo outer gears or pay a little more and get flanges and the extra dowel pins. I went with flanges...now you're making me wonder...

smbroady82 said:
I upgraded to the TG hubs and didn't have any issues, I like the idea of the newer Longfield studless hubs but they aren't cheap.

When you say TG hubs do you mean the stock replacements that TG makes?

smbroady82 · Jun 14, 2016

clemsonjeep said:
When you say TG hubs do you mean the stock replacements that TG makes?

These are what I had, 4130 chromoly
https://www.trail-gear.com/TG/Solid_Axle_Hub__Creeper_Flange_Style/i_0_0_3482/_140435-1-KIT.aspx#.V2CpWayFPIU

Here are the bling studless ones
https://www.trail-gear.com/TG/Longfield_Studless_Hub__Toyota_/i_0_0_3482/_302583-1-KIT.aspx#.V2Cp8ayFPIU

Red97 · Jun 14, 2016

Just did the 7/16 bolt upgrade on my samurai axle couple weeks ago.

The way I looked at is was

Grade 8 bolts
3/8 24, 7905 clamp lbs- 49 ftlb torque (dry)
7/16 20, 10684 clamp lb 78 ftlb torque (dry)

Without dowels/cone washers to locate, you are relying on clamping force to keep the flanges in place and tight.

I used Allen head bolts to clear the lockouts, you may be able to get away with using a std capscrews if you choose to go to 7/16.

The 3/8 bolts may work, but if you are already doing it why not go up one more size?

Rjhoward32006 · Jun 14, 2016

I'm afraid theres not enough meat in the hub for the 7/16 to actually work. Look at my oics above those are the holes drilled for 3/8 bolt but not tapped yet. Still not that much metal around them. Plus you have to run cap screws that if they ever do loosen up or break are special order and any old hardware store carries 3/8-24

Rjhoward32006 · Jun 14, 2016

The guys that do the 7/16 are primarily relying on clamping force because a lockout only has two dial pins and they are eliminating the cone washers. So
By the numbers above

3/8. 7905 x 12= 94,860

7/16. 10684 x 6= 64,104

mdo817 · Jun 14, 2016

Rjhoward32006 said:
I'm afraid theres not enough meat in the hub for the 7/16 to actually work. Look at my oics above those are the holes drilled for 3/8 bolt but not tapped yet. Still not that much metal around them. Plus you have to run cap screws that if they ever do loosen up or break are special order and any old hardware store carries 3/8-24

Especially that "one" big hardware store! Looks good Jesse.

BUG-E J · Jun 14, 2016

That studless thing is badass. After I went to arp studs I started breaking stub shafts and knuckles. I never had a problem with the studs after I went arp and I didn't cut it no slack. :dunno:

Rjhoward32006 · Jun 14, 2016

Knuckles!!! Stock ones i hope. I'm running 6 shooters and trunion eliminators so hopefully that dont happen. what brand shafts were you running?

dwa2469 · Jun 14, 2016

I caught a set of the studless hubs on fire sale last year and so far so good.

Red97 · Jun 14, 2016

Rjhoward32006 said:
I'm afraid theres not enough meat in the hub for the 7/16 to actually work. Look at my oics above those are the holes drilled for 3/8 bolt but not tapped yet. Still not that much metal around them. Plus you have to run cap screws that if they ever do loosen up or break are special order and any old hardware store carries 3/8-24

Makes sense. It would be getting a little thin, guess you can always go bigger next time if needed.

Rjhoward32006 said:
The guys that do the 7/16 are primarily relying on clamping force because a lockout only has two dial pins and they are eliminating the cone washers. So
By the numbers above

3/8. 7905 x 12= 94,860

7/16. 10684 x 6= 64,104

Yep

I don't see how either 3/8 or 7/16 would be worse than the studs&cones.

jordan7118 · Jun 15, 2016

Eliminate the split lock washers. This will sound crazy, but split lock washers actually allow a bolt to loosen over time easier than flat metal-to-metal friction. It requires less torque to loosen a nut with a split washer behind it compared to a nut with nothing behind it.

Sheared off all 6 studs and the two dowel pins on my full-float rear 80-series axle a month or so ago. Decided crowd go with ARPs. One thing I had considered was 10mm studs, cone washers, and 10mm dowel pins. Believe that's how a 100-series is setup. In the end, having non-custom parts won out over drilling stuff large. Time will tell if that was a good call :woody:

toyota104 · Jun 15, 2016

I used the 7/16 bolt in mine. With no washer and have not had any of them loosen up so far. Been running it for a year and a half with no issues. I used fj drive flanges so I was only able to put 8 bolts. You should be good with 12 of the 3/8 bolts.
.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

BUG-E J · Jun 15, 2016

Rjhoward32006 said:
Knuckles!!! Stock ones i hope. I'm running 6 shooters and trunion eliminators so hopefully that dont happen. what brand shafts were you running?

I broke inner c and 2 stock knuckles. And I ran birfield eliminator yukon shafts. When I put my yota together you couldn't get all the stuff you can now