Goodbye Logging roads, dispersed wheeling, WALKER VALLEY

bigdog165511 · Mar 25, 2011

pokey said:
Not that I like them any more than you do but whats wrong with the letter you posted ? Just think of what we could be like if we (pnw4wda) had the membership that they do. They put their differances aside and put their money where their mouth is. We could be just as powerful of a force if the majority of 4x4 user could just wake up and see how this is done :booo:

With your help, we have won protections for special places like the Reiter Foothills and Wild Sky Wilderness Area. And over the years, we have helped change the way our state

japerry · Mar 25, 2011

jeffs_62 said:
So I emailed my Senator when I started reading this thread, and got an email today that I actually didn't expect. By the time I got it, I already knew that the amendment had been pulled. but it was interesting to get the response that I did.

From Dave Upthegrove

This is still worrying. We need to rally for fines to not be levied until DNR and the state can figure out how to provide adequate ORV areas.

I agree that 99% of ORV users are 'ethical'.. but far from 99% of ORV users are legal. The same issue is with Mtn Bikers, the freeride group has very little legal area to ride, and so they've made their own. Same goes for ORVs. Its probably 50% at best that are totally legal.

I'd love to support stiffer penalties if we had sufficient legal areas to ride. The fact is we don't, and until we do, we should oppose stiffer penalties.

One example I'd use is perhaps codifying in law is that once Reiter is built, stiff penalties would be issued for illegal ORV use within a 30 mile radius of the area. Give incentive to complete an area by increasing the fines only after it is complete.

Big_MARK · Mar 25, 2011

****ING OBAMA!

:tongue:

jeffs_62 · Mar 25, 2011

japerry said:
This is still worrying. We need to rally for fines to not be levied until DNR and the state can figure out how to provide adequate ORV areas.

I agree that 99% of ORV users are 'ethical'.. but far from 99% of ORV users are legal. The same issue is with Mtn Bikers, the freeride group has very little legal area to ride, and so they've made their own. Same goes for ORVs. Its probably 50% at best that are totally legal.

I'd love to support stiffer penalties if we had sufficient legal areas to ride. The fact is we don't, and until we do, we should oppose stiffer penalties.

One example I'd use is perhaps codifying in law is that once Reiter is built, stiff penalties would be issued for illegal ORV use within a 30 mile radius of the area. Give incentive to complete an area by increasing the fines only after it is complete.

I get all that, but, being that it is an amendment to a bill that would make areas that aren't legal now, legal. The stiffer fines would go along with the bill being enacted. If the bill doesn't pass into law, the amendment, doesn't either.
That is how I understand it. I may be mistaken.

Binder · Mar 25, 2011

This is the part that concerns me..

......one requiring license plates.......

How many ****ing times do we have to pay for the same thing?!! Now we have a forest access pass. ORV tags and a license plate?........
BTW there's also legislation due to take effect this summer which closes the loophole that in the past has allowed some to purchase both ORV tags and licens tabs....One law says you must have both and another law says you can't have both.
Makes you wonder if anyone in Olympia really knows WTF is going on?

Ty. · Mar 25, 2011

jeffs_62 said:
I get all that, but, being that it is an amendment to a bill that would make areas that aren't legal now, legal. The stiffer fines would go along with the bill being enacted. If the bill doesn't pass into law, the amendment, doesn't either.
That is how I understand it. I may be mistaken.

Giving us stiffer fines, and making felons out of some of us, is ****ed. -and for what? so we can ride, or drive ORV's on the streets? We already have paved trails, so why the hell would I think that is a good trade?

pokey · Mar 25, 2011

bigdog165511 said:
With your help, we have won protections for special places like the Reiter Foothills and Wild Sky Wilderness Area. And over the years, we have helped change the way our state

jeffs_62 · Mar 25, 2011

Binder said:
This is the part that concerns me..

How many ****ing times do we have to pay for the same thing?!! Now we have a forest access pass. ORV tags and a license plate?........
BTW there's also legislation due to take effect this summer which closes the loophole that in the past has allowed some to purchase both ORV tags and licens tabs....One law says you must have both and another law says you can't have both.
Makes you wonder if anyone in Olympia really knows WTF is going on?

You are right.

There are too many "laws" already, so one thing that needs to happen is for some one to go through and delete all the useless ones, fix the ones the have mistakes in the way they are written, and get rid of the ones that are superceded by others.

Unfortunately, the folks that are in the senate right now, aren't doing that.

They are making up other stupid laws that supercede other laws, have mistakes in them, and are useless. And we sit here and wait for them to make something up that has mistakes, supercedes something, and is useless, so that we can point it out, back and forth it, bitch about it, cuss about it, whine a little, and then either pay the piper, or say "**** IT".

Either way they win.

In a perfect world, I could pay one price and be done with it, but that ain't gonna happen. Not unless we get someone in office to make it so.

Ty. said:
Giving us stiffer fines, and making felons out of some of us, is ****ed. -and for what? so we can ride, or drive ORV's on the streets? We already have paved trails, so why the hell would I think that is a good trade?

If you are thick enough to get caught three times doing stupid **** on closed land, you are probably already a felon.

I don't give a **** about riding my quad, or buggy on the street. But it would be nice to go from one trail to the next without having to go get my trailer, because I was on a FS road. My fine was a whole lot more than the $87 dollars that kid got for driving over an ecology block.

This is all a moot point anyway because it was pulled. Which means they are going to figure out a way to re-word it.

Money Mark · Mar 26, 2011

Big_MARK said:
****ING YoMomma!

:tongue:

This is funnier.

dirtygoat · Mar 26, 2011

Ima get an 8 ball and a couple of hookers and go Sheening...

Bill · Mar 26, 2011

Tod · Mar 26, 2011

They key legislators behind this want to meet with me Monday.

Keep lighting up Senator Delvin, Representatives Armstrong and Upthegrove.

[email protected]

[email protected]

[email protected]

Simple message:

If you have to amend SB5366 to pass it, just kill it now.

Ty. · Mar 26, 2011

^Done.

Money Mark · Mar 26, 2011

Tod said:
Simple message:

If you have to amend SB5366 to pass it, just kill it now.

You'll never help these guys with that attitude.

:redneck:j/k

Money Mark · Mar 26, 2011

I'm gonna throw out Luey's sig here - ACTIVIST (Definition): A person with a firm grasp of what everyone else should do. - and then toss a little :; out to everybody.

:;

japerry · Mar 27, 2011

Tod, please try to indicate that ORV penalties are something that should be stiffened up after we have sufficient designated areas. The amount of grey area/illegal wheeling is limited, and the current law keeps any new areas from turning into a Reiter situation. Any areas that have been illegally wheeled on is dispersed, and no one from DNR has noticed environmental damage from it.

If there is a way that a law could be written to get those who mud in sensitive meadows, that would be nice -- but I think the rest of the law is sufficient. Also, make it a misdemenor to vandalize DNR materials such as gates.

But key word, it shouldn't be more than an $87 ticket to ride some random trail out in the woods. It also shouldn't be more than an $87 ticket if you're riding on a logging road and didn't know and/or ignored that it was for street legal vehicles only. The difference between this and a meadow is like going 75 in a 70 and a DUI. Lets make sure going 75 isn't going to get fines as if you had a DUI.

Jaydog · Mar 28, 2011

Binder said:
This is the part that concerns me..

How many ****ing times do we have to pay for the same thing?!! Now we have a forest access pass. ORV tags and a license plate?........
BTW there's also legislation due to take effect this summer which closes the loophole that in the past has allowed some to purchase both ORV tags and licens tabs....One law says you must have both and another law says you can't have both.
Makes you wonder if anyone in Olympia really knows WTF is going on?

This is my gripe as well, when the state, and local jurisdictions are using tax money to pay for bicycle lanes and paths everywhere, and not one person on a bike pays any registration or vehicle tax, and yet wheelers pay for ORV tabs, Forest passes, yada yada, the hypocrisy is unbelievable.

Mark m. · Mar 28, 2011

Jaydog said:
This is my gripe as well, when the state, and local jurisdictions are using tax money to pay for bicycle lanes and paths everywhere, and not one person on a bike pays any registration or vehicle tax, and yet wheelers pay for ORV tabs, Forest passes, yada yada, the hypocrisy is unbelievable.

Tax those ****ing bicycles

Dave W · Mar 28, 2011

Tod said:
They key legislators behind this want to meet with me Monday.

Keep lighting up Senator Delvin, Representatives Armstrong and Upthegrove.

[email protected]

[email protected]

[email protected]

Simple message:

If you have to amend SB5366 to pass it, just kill it now.

Tod, Delvin is my Senator, and he hears from me a fair amount. Comes to Putter meetings when asked as well. Hope your meeting goes well!!!

Dave
Tri-Cities Peak Putters