trail closures

[Binder]

Maybe have chainsaw certs multiple times during the summer and then have two full weekend work party's with a full set of wheelers ready to "work to wheel" We could call it the anual Work to Wheel Nachees work party.

We need a plentifull supply of certified wheelers. at least 100-150 to at all be succesfull next year. Those people that "work to wheel can also assist in breaking trail with the U.S.F.S to designate what trails should be open and when.

That may work if the chainsaw certs are till good for the next winter. There would need to be a work party on the opening day of wheeling in the spring to beat the traffic. I usually go snow wheeling on this day and there's usually not much traffic. I think the downed trees are only a part of the problem though.....

 

[whatthe?]

So you think this is a viable solution that we should bring up to the FS? Just let everyone bring their chainsaw without training and the trees will all disapear? How is this different from year past? How well did that work then?
I'm not trying to pick on you or your ideas but sometimes it helps to think things through.

I'm saying, I don't need the FS to clear or maintain a trail for me. If I want something clear and maintained I'll drive I-90. It actually has never been tried, the FS has always cleared trails. Got to keep people thinking you're useful and use your budget money. I think it's just fine that there are work parties to clear/repair trails. Are they necessary? Up for debate.

 

[nate8887]

That may work if the chainsaw certs are till good for the next winter. There would need to be a work party on the opening day of wheeling in the spring to beat the traffic. I usually go snow wheeling on this day and there's usually not much traffic. I think the downed trees are only a part of the problem though.....

That is where this comes into play and instead of winter it would be "spring/fall routes" and "Summer Routes"


But to answer the O.P. question I think working with the F.S./D.N.R to Make two trails or a "Winter Bypass" through problem areas may be a good idea.

You have your summer trail "softer area" that would be used in the summer and winter trail "More Hardpan/firm area" This would alleviate damage and allow nature to "Heal".

We would have to figure out a way to block these alternate routes effectively but im sure there is a genious somewhere in this group that could figure it out.

 

[nate8887]

That may work if the chainsaw certs are till good for the next winter. There would need to be a work party on the opening day of wheeling in the spring to beat the traffic. I usually go snow wheeling on this day and there's usually not much traffic. I think the downed trees are only a part of the problem though.....

Opening day puts us behind the power curve it would need to be the two weekends before.

 

[Binder]

I think it's just fine that there are work parties to clear/repair trails. Are they necessary? Up for debate.

It's necessary being that many people don't carry chainsaws....I know on DNR land they don't want you to clear trails without first getting the OK but from what I understand the FS has a different policy.

 

[Binder]

Opening day puts us behind the power curve it would need to be the two weekends before.

Not possible being that's snowmobile season and they can't overlap.

 

[nate8887]

Not possible being that's snowmobile season and they can't overlap.

Forgot about those guys your right would have to be opening weekend.

 

[whatthe?]

It's necessary being that many people don't carry chainsaws....I know on DNR land they don't want you to clear trails without first getting the OK but from what I understand the FS has a different policy.

There are no DNR trails in this area, just green dot roads which get blowdowns. They may not like it but there is no rule against cutting down timber. No different that cutting wood for a campfire.

 

[whatthe?]

Opening day puts us behind the power curve it would need to be the two weekends before.

You wouldn't be able to clear a whole trail, the higher elevations still have feet of snow, some trees are still buried. Would those trails stay closed even though there would be no damage because all the wheeling is on snow? Are you suggesting just clearing some low elevation, dry (can't have mud, ruts are made) trails for memorial?

 

[Boonie Buster]

Because restriction is an easy solution for the FS.

 

[Binder]

You wouldn't be able to clear a whole trail, the higher elevations still have feet of snow, some trees are still buried. Would those trails stay closed even though there would be no damage because all the wheeling is on snow? Are you suggesting just clearing some low elevation, dry (can't have mud, ruts are made) trails for memorial?

Which is exactly why I support the seasonal closure....The big problem is the transition when the snow melts off. This uncovers trees that weren't an issue before and when the snow first start to melt people tend to follow tracks in the snow. Tracks that were first made by a snowmobile then a wheeler followed those tracks. Snow's still deep so no harm no foul but then as the snow gets thin tires start getting into dirt.....off trail.....

 

[nate8887]

You wouldn't be able to clear a whole trail, the higher elevations still have feet of snow, some trees are still buried. Would those trails stay closed even though there would be no damage because all the wheeling is on snow? Are you suggesting just clearing some low elevation, dry (can't have mud, ruts are made) trails for memorial?

Well if I couldnt make it could you? And if you can then why cant we just load up some chainsaws in your rig and go do some cutting? I am saying open as much as possible. whatever doesnt get cleared awaits some to clear it not necceserly a work party but await proper melt off and trail markins be visible.

 

[Binder]

There are no DNR trails in this area, just green dot roads which get blowdowns. They may not like it but there is no rule against cutting down timber. No different that cutting wood for a campfire.

Yes I know this. This thread is about FS trails. I brought that up so people would know not to do that on DNR trails..

 

[whatthe?]

Which is exactly why I support the seasonal closure....The big problem is the transition when the snow melts off. This uncovers trees that weren't an issue before and when the snow first start to melt people tend to follow tracks in the snow. Tracks that were first made by a snowmobile then a wheeler followed those tracks. Snow's still deep so no harm no foul but then as the snow gets thin tires start getting into dirt.....off trail.....

So then should we have a rule, no wheeling on snow unless the whole trail is snow and at least 2 feet deep? By your reasoning some trails shouldn't be open until at least july as some of the higher elevations keep snow until then. Close them in early October as that's when the snow usually starts? So we wheel in August and Sept. Some wheel for the challenge of a difficult trail, there are no difficult trails in little naches/manastash in aug and sept.

 

[Boonie Buster]

Which is exactly why I support the seasonal closure....The big problem is the transition when the snow melts off. This uncovers trees that weren't an issue before and when the snow first start to melt people tend to follow tracks in the snow. Tracks that were first made by a snowmobile then a wheeler followed those tracks. Snow's still deep so no harm no foul but then as the snow gets thin tires start getting into dirt.....off trail.....

Did you copy this from one of the other threads? I feel you've written this exact thing a couple times before.... Obviously it hasn't sunk in to most.........

 

[Boonie Buster]

So then should we have a rule, no wheeling on snow unless the whole trail is snow and at least 2 feet deep? By your reasoning some trails shouldn't be open until at least july as some of the higher elevations keep snow until then. Close them in early October as that's when the snow usually starts? So we wheel in August and Sept. Some wheel for the challenge of a difficult trail, there are no difficult trails in little naches/manastash in aug and sept.

They have that exact rule for snowmobiles...

 

[whatthe?]

That's so they don't get run over by a group of wheelers and it isn't enforced.

 

[nate8887]

They have that exact rule for snowmobiles...

We need to start thinking as a whole right now and then think of indivuduals as we organize and progress.:awesomework:

 

[nate8887]

So then should we have a rule, no wheeling on snow unless the whole trail is snow and at least 2 feet deep? By your reasoning some trails shouldn't be open until at least july as some of the higher elevations keep snow until then. Close them in early October as that's when the snow usually starts? So we wheel in August and Sept. Some wheel for the challenge of a difficult trail, there are no difficult trails in little naches/manastash in aug and sept.

We need to start thinking as a whole right now and then think of indivuduals as we organize and progress.:awesomework:

 

[Boonie Buster]

That's so they don't get run over by a group of wheelers and it isn't enforced.

It is enforced. Regardless, I vote for seasonal closures.

The Kaner Flats Massacre should have been enough evidence as to this reasoning. And obviously the F.C. took it as such.