Tree Guards

[The_Shocker]

I just read this phrase "Tree Guards" in another thread and it got me thinking. While the greenies are trying to limit our areas and use the "Damage to trees" as an excuse to limit widths and such. I know there is talk that maybe if we pay for the trees we can do whatever we want since they will be paid for but that might not get the greenies off our backs.. I'm not a Forester or biologist or whatever but I wonder if you couldn't use 1/8" or 1/4" sheets of UHMW or HDPE plastic around the base of trees. It sounds absurd but maybe it's a good comprimise for all.

 

[Eric]

I just read this phrase "Tree Guards" in another thread and it got me thinking. While the greenies are trying to limit our areas and use the "Damage to trees" as an excuse to limit widths and such. I know there is talk that maybe if we pay for the trees we can do whatever we want since they will be paid for but that might not get the greenies off our backs.. I'm not a Forester or biologist or whatever but I wonder if you couldn't use 1/8" or 1/4" sheets of UHMW or HDPE plastic around the base of trees. It sounds absurd but maybe it's a good comprimise for all.

The visual damage to the bark is less of an issue then the damage to the roots.

 

[Boonie Buster]

Go look at a hiking trail and then talk about root damage.

 

[Sandtrap1986]

Go look at a hiking trail and then talk about root damage.

:awesomework:

 

[Eric]

Go look at a hiking trail and then talk about root damage.

Hiking wont cause the tree to fall over as quickly, if at all.

 

[crash2]

Hiking wont cause the tree to fall over as quickly, if at all.

As much as I agree with root damage on hiking trails you are dead on Eric.

 

[Sandtrap1986]

root damage it root damage either way

 

[crash2]

root damage it root damage either way

True that. Even if it doesn't fall over it can very well stunt/damage its growth potential.

 

[MarcW]

Go look at a hiking trail and then talk about root damage.

No ****

Hiking wont cause the tree to fall over as quickly, if at all.

I should take you hiking sometime eric. Your eyes would truely be open then. the hiking trails have giant mud pits deep into august, trails are exlusively on exposed tree roots. fawking granola bar wrappers all over. some sections of one particular trail i am thinking of look wider than ORV trails from foot traffic. Extreme Erosion problems, etc etc etc. All in Wild Sky... Any traffic in these woods results in the same look no matter the user group. ****, animal trails in central oregon are worse though :haha: bears tear up trees there, **** all over the trail, Dig holes, beavers cut down trees without permits.... it goes on and on :flipoff:

 

[Boonie Buster]

As much as I agree with root damage on hiking trails you are dead on Eric.

Unless you physically push on the tree, no it's not gonna just fall over. but look how long trees have been standing with tree damage on the naches pass trail....for a FEW years right?! It's when you totally cut around the tree do you really kill it off quick. winching kills trees faster than root damage, you dont even have to drive next to it to kill it... so we should probably protect trees within 50ft of the trail either side...

 

[Boonie Buster]

No ****



I should take you hiking sometime eric. Your eyes would truely be open then. the hiking trails have giant mud pits deep into august, trails are exlusively on exposed tree roots. fawking granola bar wrappers all over. some sections of one particular trail i am thinking of look wider than ORV trails from foot traffic. Extreme Erosion problems, etc etc etc. All in Wild Sky... Any traffic in these woods results in the same look no matter the user group. ****, animal trails in central oregon are worse though :haha: bears tear up trees there, **** all over the trail, Dig holes, beavers cut down trees without permits.... it goes on and on :flipoff:

Yup, there is a trail i can think of on the I-90 corridor that was wide enough for the first two miles to drive my truck up comfortably and not worry about hitting a tree. It was 6-8" of standing mud for 1/2 of thhose two miles...

But you're right, 4x4ers are worse....

 

[boardbysled]

I have to agree 100%. There is something like 1000 miles of hiking trail in north western washington compared to 4.5 miles of 4x4 and ~30 miles of double/single track. Many of these 1000 miles of trail are in sensative alpine areas. Many of these trails have exposed tree roots, have mud pits that was into sensative streams and lakes, have massive ammounts of garbage. Many of these trail have illegal bypasses, have illegal trail, have sediment and maintnence issues. But you know, ORV's are the debil, mama says so.

Back to Neils idea, yes I have seen this done before, there were pictures of a trail down in oregon that opened last year that had something similar done. But, I have to agree, root damage is the main damage to the trees. Bark damage (for the most part) is just a little more visual, so thats why the greenies use it.

Edit: Also, trail compaction can lead to stunting a tree's growth.

 

[Boonie Buster]

We were joking on our last trip out when we found a piece of carpet, to wrap it around the tree so as not to hurt the trucks paint! :haha:


:corn: Maybe the Carpet can match the drapes...for a more "natural" look ya know!.

 

[Eric]

No ****



I should take you hiking sometime eric. Your eyes would truely be open then. the hiking trails have giant mud pits deep into august, trails are exlusively on exposed tree roots. fawking granola bar wrappers all over. some sections of one particular trail i am thinking of look wider than ORV trails from foot traffic. Extreme Erosion problems, etc etc etc. All in Wild Sky... Any traffic in these woods results in the same look no matter the user group. ****, animal trails in central oregon are worse though :haha: bears tear up trees there, **** all over the trail, Dig holes, beavers cut down trees without permits.... it goes on and on :flipoff:

Marc I know exactly what kind of trail you are talking about. I am not saying they dont exist. And I am not on any ones side for this, both sides do a fair amount of damage but we have the potential to do much more damage in a shorter amount of time then a group of hikers.

Unless you physically push on the tree, no it's not gonna just fall over. but look how long trees have been standing with tree damage on the naches pass trail....for a FEW years right?! It's when you totally cut around the tree do you really kill it off quick. winching kills trees faster than root damage, you dont even have to drive next to it to kill it... so we should probably protect trees within 50ft of the trail either side...

I have seen trees get "knocked" over from driving next to them. I have also seen trees that move considerably when you drive next to them or walk on the softer soil. I have also seen root systems completly underminded by a trail. The push may just be a wind storm, but regardless the tree had a weakend root system due to a trail. This may be due to run off issues on 4x4 or even hiking trails. The bottom line is the tree would still have been standing if the trail was not there.


I am not trying to step on anyones toes. I was just trying to answer the questions asked. The enviromental side is if nature destroys itself then so be it, but Humans can not aid in the destruction. Yes I know its not always possible but this is what we have to deal with and what we have to try and plan for.

 

[Eric]

Edit: Also, trail compaction can lead to stunting a tree's growth.

You should know this, its part of your degree.

Soil compaction is a major issue, not only for the health of the trees but also run off and erosion issues.

Plant roots need to breath too. There is a reason why plants dont grow in certain types of soil and certain conditions.

 

[Boonie Buster]

Ya, im not saying it can't happen any faster, cus it does. But it's the same situation for EVERY outdoor traveling activity. Hell. people knock down more trees on the sides of roads from drag racing drunk than we do, i'm sure of it.

 

[boardbysled]

You should know this, its part of your degree.

Shhhh... dont tell people that, they'll think I'm smart an educated or something:fawkdancesmiley::haha:



My metaphor I like to use is that ORV's are a grain of sand in the sandbox that is Western Washington. But we are put more heavily under the microscope because we are motorized recreation.

 

[The_Shocker]

Good points by all. It doesn't matter what a hiking trail looks like though because we all know their **** don't stink. I see the point about the roots but it seems like the bark is what everyone likes to point out and hence where we might get some credit for trying to protect them. I dunno...like I said it was a pretty absurd idea.

 

[Boonie Buster]

Good points by all. It doesn't matter what a hiking trail looks like though because we all know their **** don't stink. I see the point about the roots but it seems like the bark is what everyone likes to point out and hence where we might get some credit for trying to protect them. I dunno...like I said it was a pretty absurd idea.

The problem with tying or attaching stuff to a tree is that theyre gonna grow... and possibly have the rope/cable/whatever, choke out the tree eventually. And nailing/screwing stuff to trees will NOT fly with the greenies...

 

[Money Mark]

Simply put: no matter how you do it, protecting a tree is a high maintenance item; no matter how you look at. And as stated before, one would ultimately want to protect the root system......that is an impossible task, IMO.

For a trail with difficulty, driving over rock is the answer, when trees are out of the question.