What's the deal with Highrock?

ain'tstuckjustresting · Mar 28, 2012

So I was talking to a guy at work yesterday that snowmobiles up around Highrock. He was complaining that someone with HUGE BOGGERS drove over the berm and left ruts all the way up the hill on the groomed portion of the road the snow machines use. Everything I read says the roads up there are closed for the winter.

I realize we do what we've done for years regardless of the rule changes but if it's a groomed road for the guys that buy a snopark pass is it a douche move to mob up it in a big ol' turd bucket? :corn:

chance · Mar 28, 2012

Was not me but i did go up there this year, I did not know it was a snow park. On the way up I did not see any gates or signs Unless the snow covered them. A couple days later a old timer at work told me what I did and felt bad about what I did.

ain'tstuckjustresting · Mar 28, 2012

Oh, I know who it was. Just not 100% sure if they were committing douchebagary or not.......................

ChopTop84 · Mar 28, 2012

My understanding of the snopark rules and sleds is, if the trail is groomed, it is off limits to any and all wheeled vehicles. I called one year and asked about running quads on the sled trails in the winter if I buy one of their snopark passes and was told no. I could convert the quad over to tracks/skis for the winter but even then, Im not 100% sure it would fly with the sled guys.

Jokenring · Mar 28, 2012

General douchebaggery was committed. Those boys pay for the grooming, let them have it. April comes soon enough and they will be "open" again.
:swing:

Jokenring · Mar 28, 2012

ChopTop84 said:
My understanding of the snopark rules and sleds is, if the trail is groomed, it is off limits to any and all wheeled vehicles. I called one year and asked about running quads on the sled trails in the winter if I buy one of their snopark passes and was told no. I could convert the quad over to tracks/skis for the winter but even then, Im not 100% sure it would fly with the sled guys.

Tracked vehicles other than snowmobiles are prohibited in the snow parks.

dirtygoat · Mar 28, 2012

Is the berm up a ways or down below???

ain'tstuckjustresting · Mar 28, 2012

dirtygoat said:
Is the berm up a ways or down below???

Not sure. We were going to do a snow run in Nov. but since most of our rigs are not street legal I checked with the Cowlitz office and they said the road to highrock was closed to wheeled vehicles for the season. They didn't specify boundaries of course.

JAWS · Mar 28, 2012

:corn:

I wonder if the same guy stopped at the Elbe Mall for fuel on his way up to destroy the High Rock area :stirpot:

Corey Y · Mar 28, 2012

We were up there testing out a tracked vehicle, and 54" Boggers at 1psi leave no ruts on a compacted snow surface. :stirpot:

I even talked to a couple guys on sleds and they agreed that I was not leaving ruts, but less of an impression in the groomed snow than what sleds leave. :kissmybutt:

The Paradise estate side is not groomed if you want to snow wheel at High Rock :awesomework:

pokey · Mar 28, 2012

ain'tstuckjustresting said:
Not sure. We were going to do a snow run in Nov. but since most of our rigs are not street legal I checked with the Cowlitz office and they said the road to highrock was closed to wheeled vehicles for the season. They didn't specify boundaries of course.

So what are the season dates ? Seems like there have been quite a few run reports over the winter involving highrock and the area around it. Groomed trails and roads are definatly a no-no though. Once a berm is pushed up then as far as the FS in concerned it is closed as well.

CHOP SHOP · Mar 28, 2012

I have NEVER seen a groomed trail at HighRock.

I have never seen a groomer on high rock.

I have NEVER heard of it being off limits in winter.

If it is closed in winter months, how the **** am I supposed to get the Xmas tree I paid for?

Corey Y · Mar 28, 2012

I cant find any info on it being closed

http://www.fs.usda.gov/recarea/giffordpinchot/recarea/?recid=74305

The road system up there is pretty big. One road is groomed and it closes access to about 20 other roads for 4x4 snow wheeling. With the seasonal closure and loss of snow wheeling at Evans CreeK, it would be nice if access to these roads were left open.

Corey Y · Mar 28, 2012

ain'tstuckjustresting said:
Not sure. We were going to do a snow run in Nov. but since most of our rigs are not street legal I checked with the Cowlitz office and they said the road to highrock was closed to wheeled vehicles for the season. They didn't specify boundaries of course.

I called the Cowlitz Valley Ranger District and the Ranger said it is OK to take 4x4 vehicles on that road system.

Jacob · Mar 28, 2012

I have been up there a couple of times since snow fell and there were definitely NO berms, signs, or anything otherwise stating it being off limits to any type of vehicle. I will admit that some parts of the trail seemed to be groomed, but I am not sure if that wasn't just some over excited groomer that went beyond the boundaries of the designated snow park that is on some of the roads on the side closest to Copper Creek/Ashford. Every time I went up, I went around to the back side and there is NO evidence of anything stating closures or no access to wheeled vehicles. I made ruts up there with Chance last month, so if I am guilty of any wrong doing I apologize.

pokey · Mar 28, 2012

Just talked to my contact at the Cowlitz ranger station and he stated that the information posted on their site is accurate and that the route as listed below is open to wheeled traffic all winter. He is going to double check with their LEO and get back with me this afternoon. There are however several differant roads that are groomed and are off limits to wheeled vehicles. You need to know where you are and which roads are open and which ones are closed.
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Forest Road 85

Area Status: Not Cleared FR 85 travels south from FR 52 near Big Creek Campground, to FR 47. The road is paved from FR 52 for approximately 6 miles to the FR 8440 jct., then becomes gravel.

The road provides access to FR 8440 that goes to Highrock Lookout TH

Jacob · Mar 28, 2012

When we were out there the snow park signs were posted on the 85 side. There were no postings, gates, signs, berms or anything on the 84 side.

Is it possible that they have them backwards? Maybe I am remembering it all wrong....

Also, the recreation map for GP Forest doesn't show any snow parks in that area.

Can you ask them specifically the status of 85, 84, and 8440?

pokey · Mar 28, 2012

FS reply

So heres what I got from Jack. Hope this clears up this issue.

Jim,

Thanks for your call regarding the legalities of 4x4 access to the High Rock area during the winter months. In our phone conversation, you raised a couple questions about access and closures in that area during the winter, particularly related to snowmobile use.

There are two primary access routes for destinations in the High Rock Trailhead area.

First, and apparently foremost to your interests, is the 85/8440 route from Kernahan Road/FR52 to the High Rock Trailhead. We do not formally close the 85 road or the 8440 road to 4-wheel traffic during the winter months. Therefore, it is legal for you to drive on those roads at any time, including over the snow with the aid of chains, high-flotation tires, etc. The most likely violation in so doing would be damage to forest resources

Jacob · Mar 28, 2012

Thanks Jim. I think they may want to rethink their signage out there or get this information out better. Last time I was there, 85 had snow park signs on it leading you to believe you were going to a snow park and that 4x4 use was not allowed. 84 had no information leading you to believe that 4x4 use was allowed. From what he is saying 85 to 8440 is ok, but 84 to 8440 is not ok. Maybe it is just me, but it looks like it was "signed" backwards out there.

Either way, at least now we have a somewhat official answer.

Thank you.

Nancy Barker · Mar 29, 2012

The 85 Rd is correctly posted. It does lead to a non-motorized Sno-Park. The 85 Rd is plowed up to the DNR rd about 1.5 miles from Kernahan, and then into the 1 Road Sno-Park. The 85 Rd beyond the DNR road is not plowed and does not access any Sno-Parks.

Hope that clears up any confusion.